Czech Pirc Defense Trouble

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SingleLeg2

Any advice?  Keep at it?  Study and memorize more? 

Trying to learn the Czech Pirc defense as a novice player, but I lose badly almost every game.  I'm a pretty new player, elo between 700 and 850.  Playing white I have improved a lot with the queens gambit.  Have always lost a lot of games fast when black, but my Czech Pirc games (black) almost always are crap. 

sndeww

Memorize? It is not an opening you should be memorizing. It should be more of a thematic opening. (I.e. memorize ideas not moves)

I would also not recommend it to people close to your rating range, as it violates several opening principles and blacks play is mostly based on sitting there and countering white’s advances. If you like the queens gambit, I would recommend you drop the Czech pirc for something more principled, like 1…e5 or 1…e6.

Ethan_Brollier

Yeah I have some advice. Drop the Czech Pirc. It isn't good, if you really want to play something hypermodern, Modern Defense is just better than the Pirc.

Gibbilo
I woulda wager that many of your losses have to do with a combination of 1. Blundering to tactics 2. Not able to identify a simple plan. Playing pirc as a beginner is less helpful at developing those skills, compared to other openings. So you need to ask yourself, how quickly would you like to improve ? if your desire is to have fun, play an opening that interests you, maybe improve a little over time, than keeping playing the pirc. if your goal is rapid improvement, likely, switch to something else. Simple chess. Clear ideas.
nuttyt

I play the main line Pirc I think this is much better than the Czech Pirc. I will be doing some vids on it soon.
Check out www.youtube.com/@nuttychesstips

Ethan_Brollier
nuttyt wrote:

I play the main line Pirc I think this is much better than the Czech Pirc. I will be doing some vids on it soon.
Check out www.youtube.com/@nuttychesstips

Better yes but it's still a terrible opening for U1500s bc the theory in the mainlines are essentially a series of only-moves with massive consequences if you miss a single move, and the end result is a KID-esque structure down a tempo. I wouldn't recommend the Pirc to hardly anyone unless they mained it from the start of their chess career and somehow made it to like 1700 using the opening.

dpnorman

If that’s an accurate assessment of your rating, then whatever results you’re having are almost certainly not due to the opening. They could be due to mistakes you’re making in the opening, but not due to the opening quality itself. You can play any opening at that rating and be successful as long as you play it well. Actually, no matter how much I’d like to claim otherwise, the same is somewhat true at my rating too, at least in online chess where opp-specific preparation isn’t much of a thing 

So basically, it’s up to you if you want to change your opening or stick to it, but I doubt that your results will significantly change either way. I mean you could take up one of these various meme openings that “gotham” or whoever else recommends, and you’ll win some games via traps. But you won’t actually improve your chess ability without *improving your chess ability* and that takes time, and any silly trappy lines are more shortcuts than solutions

And yeah I don’t know if I’d recommend spending a lot of time memorizing stuff, I think again it’s about putting in the time to become stronger at chess. Be patient, remember improvement doesn’t happen overnight. Best of luck!

SingleLeg2

Thanks to all who responded.  Something worthwhile in every post.  Dumping the Czech pirc but not sure what to try out.   Posting another question. 

 

LogoCzar

~5000 rapid games w/U1000 rating? You are probably an adult improver, this article can help. Tactics and repetition are key! I was about to link you to Paul Swaney's blog on his road to 2000 USCF as an adult improver who learned chess at age 25, but it was taken down. 

The Pirc is tricky to play at club level because of its indirect approach to the center, but I can see why it would be appealing - closed positions are easier to survive with a setup without getting blown back by tactics. Still, White will have a big center making it tricky to develop, and tactics are more important than openings, especially U1200. Best of luck!

sndeww

@dpnorman while I agree that it's likely not an opening problem, some openings are just more convoluted than others, and I feel like the czech pirc is one of them. Development is often counterintuitive (3...Qa5) and breaks principles (3...Qa5) and there are better ways to achieve its plans (...e5) which may all contribute to more blunders than necessary.

darkunorthodox88

i wonder why you chose the czech pirc. its off the beaten path and doesnt have as many  tricks as other stuff like 1.b6. 

like,,  why not a philidor instead?

SingleLeg2
LogoCzar wrote:

~5000 rapid games w/U1000 rating? . . .. Best of luck!

 As I re-read your comment, the best reading of the first sentence is an insult. But I'm guessing that it just came out wrong. 

PS. I ditched all the black openings with names, stuck to 15/10 games, and jumped to >900.

Sea_TurtIe

idk

SamuelAjedrez95
fullmerfamily wrote:
LogoCzar wrote:

~5000 rapid games w/U1000 rating? . . .. Best of luck!

 As I re-read your comment, the best reading of the first sentence is an insult. But I'm guessing that it just came out wrong. 

PS. I ditched all the black openings with names, stuck to 15/10 games, and jumped to >900.

These fools tell you to play openings. I used to be only 150 rated, then I stopped playing openings entirely and I instantly got boosted up to 1500. As soon as I started playing openings again, my skill declined. Openings are bad for your chess. Never play openings.

sndeww

me when i stop playing openings (there is no game without the opening)

Ethan_Brollier
SamuelAjedrez95 wrote:
fullmerfamily wrote:
LogoCzar wrote:

~5000 rapid games w/U1000 rating? . . .. Best of luck!

 As I re-read your comment, the best reading of the first sentence is an insult. But I'm guessing that it just came out wrong. 

PS. I ditched all the black openings with names, stuck to 15/10 games, and jumped to >900.

These fools tell you to play openings. I used to be only 150 rated, then I stopped playing openings entirely and I instantly got boosted up to 1500. As soon as I started playing openings again, my skill declined. Openings are bad for your chess. Never play openings.

I'm the exact opposite. I started out by studying openings, common mistakes, blunders, common middlegame ideas, and tactics, and now most of my wins come from an advantage out of the opening that lasts until tactics present themselves. My endgames are absolutely horrendous, and if I don't play openings, my middlegames are also absolutely horrendous. Essentially I'm a boosted monkey carried by my opening choices, but I'm okay with that. Studying mainly theory got me from 1000 to 1700 in less than a year, now I just need to improve other aspects of my chess, and I hope to both become 2000 on Chess.com and start playing in OTB tournaments regularly within the next two years.

SingleLeg2
Professordoctor9 wrote:

I get the fact that somebody improves faster and somebody slower, but if youre below 1000 after playing 5000 rapid games, then the real problem is most likely wrong approach to learning chess. You probably just play games for fun and dont study much, analyze games and watch educational videos. The best thing is to combine all of what i said, and that got me from around 800 to around 1500 in less that 2 years and 450 rapid games. In the meantime i also played a lot of blitz and bullet games just for fun.

I guess it's right that I played 5k games, but it was in the span of about 8 months -- my first games. I was playing 10 minute games and made terrible, obvious blunders every game -- so I was stuck at between 500 and 600. As much as anything, moving to 15/10 helped me to get and stay over 900.

When you guys say don't use openings, how do you avoid getting crushed. I'm very easy to beat, especially when black, quickly.

SingleLeg2

I think the judgment over the 5k games is inapt. Often I played while falling asleep, before I knew anything about the game at all, just to kill time at sporting events, etc. It averages to about 20 games per day, which doesn't even seem possible.

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