Is it the gruenfeld or the grunfeld?

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marvellosity
Semester wrote:

i think you guys are trying to tell me that it is both


I told you the precise answer right at the beginning, and I don't need to be a master to be correct. Something like "thanks" wouldn't go amiss, rather than "I was hoping a master would comment".

marvellosity
Reb wrote:
hackattack wrote:

just out of interest, is it always possible to get a gruenfeld defence against the English opening, or if white plays something else after playing c4, his position will be bad? Thanks


 Against some white move orders in the English black cannot play Gruenfeld, which is why I quit relying on it as my main defense against Q-side openings.  1 c4 Nf6  2 Nc3 g6  3 e4 and black cannot play gruenfeld lines now.


Reb - 2...d5!?

hackattack
marvellosity wrote:
Reb wrote:
hackattack wrote:

just out of interest, is it always possible to get a gruenfeld defence against the English opening, or if white plays something else after playing c4, his position will be bad? Thanks


 Against some white move orders in the English black cannot play Gruenfeld, which is why I quit relying on it as my main defense against Q-side openings.  1 c4 Nf6  2 Nc3 g6  3 e4 and black cannot play gruenfeld lines now.


Reb - 2...d5!?


ooh nice one, does white have any other good ways to avoid the gruenfeld after 2.d5!?

Harrr

Anglo-Grünfeld Var. if White takes pawn, but what if 3. e3!? then? Can't imagine other plays (3.Nf3?) anyway.

marvellosity

I can't believe 3.e3 is that challenging; perhaps then 3...g6 or 3...c5.

TheOldReb
hackattack wrote:
marvellosity wrote:
Reb wrote:
hackattack wrote:

just out of interest, is it always possible to get a gruenfeld defence against the English opening, or if white plays something else after playing c4, his position will be bad? Thanks


 Against some white move orders in the English black cannot play Gruenfeld, which is why I quit relying on it as my main defense against Q-side openings.  1 c4 Nf6  2 Nc3 g6  3 e4 and black cannot play gruenfeld lines now.


Reb - 2...d5!?


ooh nice one, does white have any other good ways to avoid the gruenfeld after 2.d5!?


 After  2... d5  3 cxd5 Nxd5  4 g3  the positions are more english than gruenfeld imo. Black is deprived of the white center to attack which is so typical of gruenfeld lines. The position is classified as A16 : the English- Anglo-Gruenfeld  defense.

marvellosity

Agreed Reb, but 2...d5 does offer many more transpositional possibilities than other moves such as 2...g6 like you said. After 4...c5 in your line there Black should have good, free play. In other words I think Black has 'tricked' White into a not overly critical line of the English.

chessoholicalien
Scarblac wrote:

 Actually I think that it's also allowed in German, if you can't write the umlaut for some reason, then ue is acceptable. So probably the same rule was just used in English.


Correct.

Semester

cool

tanmay_chakrabarti

It is grunfeld

Source: Wikipedia

 

History

The Indian(bengali added by me) player Moheschunder Bannerjee played the opening as early as 1855 against John Cochrane. However, it is named for Ernst Grünfeld, who introduced it into international play at Vienna 1922, where, in his first game with the defense, he defeated future world champion Alexander Alekhine.[1] Interestingly, Grünfeld usually employed a very classical style. The defence was later adopted by a number of prominent players, including Vasily Smyslov, Viktor Korchnoi and Bobby Fischer. Garry Kasparov often used the defence, including in his World Championship matches against Anatoly Karpov in 1986, 1987 and 1990, and Vladimir Kramnik in 2000. Currently active notable players who employ the opening include Loek Van Wely, Peter Svidler, Peter Leko and Luke McShane.[2]

The Game of the Century between Donald Byrne and 13-year old Bobby Fischer on October 17, 1956, featured this opening, although arriving in the Grünfeld via a transposition of moves(using 1.Nf3 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.Nc3 Bg7 4.d4 O-O 5.Bf4 d5).

Exchange Variation

Start of chess board.
a8 black rook b8 black knight c8 black bishop d8 black queen e8 black king f8 black bishop h8 black rook
a7 black pawn b7 black pawn c7 black pawn e7 black pawn f7 black pawn h7 black pawn
g6 black pawn
d5 black knight
d4 white pawn e4 white pawn
c3 white knight
a2 white pawn b2 white pawn f2 white pawn g2 white pawn h2 white pawn
a1 white rook c1 white bishop d1 white queen e1 white king f1 white bishop g1 white knight h1 white rook
End of chess board.
Grünfeld, Exchange Variation

The main line of the Grünfeld, the Exchange Variation (ECO codes D85-D89), is defined by the continuation 4.cxd5 Nxd5 5.e4. Now White has an imposing looking centre - and the main continuation 5...Nxc3 6.bxc3 strengthens it still further. Black generally attacks White's centre with ...c5 and ...Bg7, often followed by moves such as ...cxd4, ...Bg4, and ...Nc6. White often uses his big centre to launch an attack against Black's king. One subvariation, frequently played by Karpov, including four games of his 1987 world championship match against Kasparov in Seville, Spain, is the Seville Variation, after 6....Bg7 7.Bc4 c5 8.Ne2 Nc6 9.Be3 O-O 10.O-O Bg4 11.f3 Na5 12.Bxf7+, long thought a poor move by theory, as the resultant light-square weakness had been believed to give Black more than enough compensation for the pawn.

White can develop his pieces in a number of ways in the Exchange Variation. For decades, theory held that the correct method of development was with Bc4 and Ne2, often followed by 0-0 and f4-f5, playing for a central breakthrough or kingside attack. It was generally thought that an early Nf3 was weak in the Exchange Variation because it allowed Black too much pressure on the centre with ...Bg4. In the late 1970s, however, Karpov, Kasparov and others found different methods to play the Exchange Variation with White, often involving an early Rb1 to remove the rook from the sensitive a1-h8 diagonal, as well as attempting to hinder the development of Black's queenside. Another, relatively recently developed system involves quickly playing Be3, Qd2, and Rc1 or Rd1 to fortify White's centre, remove White's rook from the diagonal, and possibly enable an early d5 push by White.

Vladimir Kramnik and Boris Gelfand are the leading practitioners as White and Lubomir Ftacnik has had many fine results with the Black pieces.[2]

[edit] Lines with 4.Bf4 and the Grünfeld Gambit

Start of chess board.
a8 black rook b8 black knight c8 black bishop d8 black queen e8 black king f8 black bishop h8 black rook
a7 black pawn b7 black pawn c7 black pawn e7 black pawn f7 black pawn h7 black pawn
f6 black knight g6 black pawn
d5 black pawn
c4 white pawn d4 white pawn f4 white bishop
c3 white knight
a2 white pawn b2 white pawn e2 white pawn f2 white pawn g2 white pawn h2 white pawn
a1 white rook d1 white queen e1 white king f1 white bishop g1 white knight h1 white rook
End of chess board.
Grünfeld 4.Bf4

For players who do not wish to take on the complexities of the Exchange Variation, the move 4.Bf4 is generally considered a safer continuation for White.[3] White opts for the initiative on the queenside with a smaller pawn centre. In the main line (D82), play proceeds with 4...Bg7 5.e3 c5 6.dxc5 Qa5, with White's choice for the seventh move being cxd5, Qb3, Qa4, or Rc1. Despite its reputation, in statistical databases this variation shows only a slightly higher percentage of White wins and draws, as opposed to the Exchange variation.[4][5] The variation is not often met in top-flight play today, its usage having declined significantly since its heyday in the 1930s.[citation needed]

Start of chess board.
a8 black rook b8 black knight c8 black bishop d8 black queen f8 black rook g8 black king
a7 black pawn b7 black pawn c7 black pawn e7 black pawn f7 black pawn g7 black bishop h7 black pawn
f6 black knight g6 black pawn
d5 black pawn
c4 white pawn d4 white pawn f4 white bishop
c3 white knight e3 white pawn
a2 white pawn b2 white pawn f2 white pawn g2 white pawn h2 white pawn
a1 white rook d1 white queen e1 white king f1 white bishop g1 white knight h1 white rook
End of chess board.
Grünfeld Gambit

In this variation, play may also continue (4. Bf4 Bg7 5.e3) O-O, which is known as the Grünfeld Gambit (ECO code D83). White can accept the gambit by playing 6.cxd5 Nxd5 7.Nxd5 Qxd5 8.Bxc7, or decline it with 6. Qb3 or 6. Rc1, to which Black responds with 6...c5.

[edit] The Neo-Grünfeld Defence

Start of chess board.
a8 black rook b8 black knight c8 black bishop d8 black queen e8 black king f8 black bishop h8 black rook
a7 black pawn b7 black pawn c7 black pawn e7 black pawn f7 black pawn h7 black pawn
f6 black knight g6 black pawn
d5 black pawn
c4 white pawn d4 white pawn
g3 white pawn
a2 white pawn b2 white pawn e2 white pawn f2 white pawn h2 white pawn
a1 white rook b1 white knight c1 white bishop d1 white queen e1 white king f1 white bishop g1 white knight h1 white rook
End of chess board.
Neo-Grünfeld Defence

Systems in which White delays the development of his queen's knight to c3 are known as the Neo-Grünfeld Defence (ECO code D70-D79); typical move orders are 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.f3 d5 or, more commonly, 1. d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3. g3 d5 (the latter is known as the Kemeri Variation, shown in the diagram).

[edit] Russian System: 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.Qb3

In bringing more pressure to bear against Black's central outpost on d5, White practically forces ....dxc4, thus gaining a central preponderance; however, in return, his queen will often be exposed as Black's queenside play unfolds in the middlegame. After 5....dxc4 6.Qxc4 0-0 7.e4, Black has several primary options to hand: 7....Bg4 8.Be3 Nfd7 (Smyslov Variation), a topical line from the 1950s through the mid 1970s, 7....Na6 (Lodewijk Prins') idea, 7....Nc6 and 7....c6.

[edit] Taimanov's Variation With 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.Bg5

In this line, favoured by Yasser Seirawan, after the nearly universal 5....Ne4, White may play 6.Bh4 Nxc3 7.bxc3 or 6.cxd5, with Black then opting for either 6....Nxc3 7.bxc3 Qxd5 or 6....Nxg5 7.Nxg5 e6, though in the latter case, 7....c6 is sometimes tried. After 6.cxd5 Nxg5 7.Nxg5 e6, White has 8.Qd2 exd5 9.Qe3+, with attacking chances, or the more usual 8.Nf3 exd5, after which play generally proceeds on lines analogous to the Queen's Gambit Declined, Exchange Variation, with a queenside minority attack by White (b2-b4-b5xc6), as Black aims for the traditional kingside play with ....f7-f5-f4 and, in this case, ....g6-g5.

[edit] Other variations

Apart from the above, among the more popular continuations are:

  • 4.Bg5 (the Taimanov Variation, ECO code D80)
  • 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.Qa4+ (the Flohr Variation, ECO code D90)
  • 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.e3 (the Quiet System or Slow System, ECO code D94)
  • 4.cxd5 Nxd5 5.Na4 (the Nadanian Variation, ECO code D85)

[

Zugzeit

Its either way i'm guessing there are many different spellings

marvellosity
tanmay_chakrabarti wrote:
It is grunfeld Source: Wikipedia

 

 

Seriously... did you not read any of the thread? Even your own source confirms what has already been said on this thread.

Semester

yeah i think we get the point

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