Is that true that Polish/Sokolsky/Orangutan opening, only playable >2200 ?

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ESP-918

I've heard from some source, that this opening only works if you play with someone under 2200 Elo rating.

So basically my question is

, is it possible to constantly play this opening, say if you are 2200 Elo plus.

Will you have like 50 50%of winnings or more or its so bad that you will get crushed no metter what?

bank2010

The opening isn't refuted. It's a playable at any levels. If both sides play correctly, White will end up in a slightly worse position. If you play this opening every game, the chance is like playing Black pieces (in general)

ESP-918

What opening would you recommend? Except e4 or d4, as everyone playing it almost from begging when they introduced to chess.

I need something for a tricky play or tricky style of play if you know what I mean

Karpark
Polish = !?
Grob = ?!
imsighked2

I'd never seen it before, in a game, but ended up checkmating my opponent in a recent game after setting up a nice queen trap. I used the exchange version as black. Even though I gave up a center pawn, I gave my opponent an isolated pawn I later attacked and won, and had better pawn structure. I think 1 . . . e5 is the best response.

SmithyQ

One possibility is to play 1.Nf3 first, and then after most Black moves (like Nf6 or d5) you can play 2.b4 and get an 'improved' Polish, since White can't play the 1...e5 lines.  The only way you can't is if Black plays e6, g6 or Nc6, but even if Black does, you get a pretty free game.

Alternatively, there is nothing wrong with 1.b3.  White doesn't get an advantage, but he gets a harmonious position where Black can easily go wrong.

In neither of these openings does White get an advantage, but he still gets a solid position where he can outplay his opponent.  That's good enough for me.  Besides, it's not like White is proving much of an advantage in more standard lines like the Berlin endgame, so why not?

ESP-918

👍

Karpark

If I'm not mistaken I think the deferred or 'improved' Polish is what is termed strictly speaking The Orang Utan. 

fishyvishy

This is actually interesting and counter intuitive. I'd assume that Orangutans would not even rate 1200. Wow, every day you learn something!

ESP-918

kindaspongey

"... the Sokolsky Opening ... can be used as a surprise weapon, but frequent use makes you an easy target, because provided Black knows what he is doing, he will get at least equal chances. ..." - Carsten Hansen (2000)

https://web.archive.org/web/20140708234438/http://www.chesscafe.com/text/hansen15.txt

ESP-918

Very good answer Kindaspongey, what opening would you recommend? for a frequent use that is strong and also have sone surprise to eat

ESP-918

☝👍

kindaspongey
jengaias wrote:

... In Ruy Lopez Black equalises too if he knows what he is doing. ...

Is there a difference (between Sokolsky and Ruy Lopez) in the amount of difficulty that Black has in the task of equalizing?

kindaspongey
jengaias wrote:

Probably [there is] not [a difference (between Sokolsky and Ruy Lopez) in the amount of difficulty that Black has in the task of equalizing].

After 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 Black can play 3...Nf6(yes , the Berlin) and it's already equal "if he knows what he is doing".

Perhaps the difference lies in the amount of difficulty involved in knowing what one is doing?

blueemu

Here's another vote for 1. Nf3.

I like to play that opening as a Barcza System (2. g3, 3. Bg2, 4. d3 or 0-0, etc). There are at least half-a-dozen different central formations that White can adopt from there, and as Black it is very difficult to prepare against each of them.

kindaspongey

jengaias wrote: "... Regarding the opening , Ruy Lopez is a relatively simple opening.

Usually your ability to play common sense chess and studying a few games is enough. ..."

Bologan's Ruy Lopez for Black has over 500 pages.

ESP-918

🖖♚

ESP-918

🤔

kindaspongey
jengaias wrote:

... although [Bologan's Ruy Lopez for Black] deals with the most theoretical lines (Marshal and Breyer) you only need to read around 20 pages to get started(the "fast lane repertoire" he has in the beginning of each chapter).

Is enough "to get started" the same as enough to know "what" one "is doing" and maintain at least equality as Black? If so, why would the Marshall and Breyer be considered to be "the most theoretical"?

jengaias wrote:

It's even less if you choose a line that doesn't have so much theory.

There are somewhere around 270 pages in The Berlin Defence by Igor Lysyj and Roman Ovetchkin. It is about the same situation in The Spanish Main Road by Evgeny Solozhenkin (advocating Zaitzev). Even The Cozio Defence by Alexey Dreev goes on for over 200 pages.