Modern Defence vs Pirc Defence

Wich is better? Wich do you play as black? Pirc defence seems pretty solid because you can get your king castled fast but, I have found it hard to defend against a 150-attack when white sets up a battery with his queen and dark sq bishop. When playing the modern you dont have to worry about that for quite some time. I guess the only downside is delayed castling but what is more important? Anyone here have experience with the two and can shed some light over it?

It's the same thing except the modern gives white more flexibility with  a possible c4 but it tries to immediately use the unblocked bishop. That usually doesn't work though. But against some lines against white in the modern it is correct to play ...d5, but usually it's the same as pirc. If you don't mind playing against the king's indian (if white plays c4) then you might like the modern. 

I prefer the Modern, I just find it to be a bit more flexible, although neither really appeals to me.  I can't deal with giving up that much space, although I do play Alekhine's defense.

pirc defense is good!

I prefer the pirc because you are giving white less options, the e4 pawn is hit so Nc3 is almost forced, with the modern you are giving him more flexibility, like playing c4 then Nc3 and transposing into many different lines of the KID

White can also play 3.f3.  Motany recommends it, and Black basically has a choice between accepting the fact that he will be in a Saemisch Kings Indian after 3...g6, or enter a passive old Indian defense with 3...e5.

So no, Nc3 is not forced, just highly popular.

As Black, played the Modern briefly about half a decade ago, and the Pirc a few times back in 1997, but I basically avoid both when Black has 4 far better options.  e5, e6, c5, or c6, with the second being my personal preference, but all 4 beat the Pirc or Modern.

What are you basing this off? It is impossible to say that e5, e6, c6, c5 BEAT the pirc, if you ask modern engines they will say that the pirc beats your beloved french

Saying that the pirc can be beaten by the St George Attack implies that there is a clear refutation or forced win by white, clearly none of which exist.

Against the most aggressive White options, choice between Pirc and Modern boils down to the question: would you rather delay bishop or knight developement. It's the case of something like 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 g6 4.f3 c6 5.Be3 b5 versus 1.e4 g6 2.d4 Bg7 3.Nc3 d6 4.Be3 a6 5.Qd2 b5. Early developement of both bishop and knight might lose You a tempo against Bh6. Personally I find Modern move order more natural, but it can be argued that the Pirc one puts more pressure on White.

I feel as though the modern is more flexible than the pirc. I have some experience in lines in which you go for g6 Bg7 d6 a6 b5 with Black, and these positions tend to be very sharp. However, I find the Rat positions (kind of like a Caro-Kann but with g6 included) to be the best. This is a bit of a controversial position, but these lines tend to be solid while also giving you chances to attack. Here's an example position:

I've played positions like this many times over my chess career, with pretty good success. Black can develop pressure against the White pain chain with relative ease, as moves such as c5 and Nf7 threaten to weaken the pawn chain significantly. 

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Modern is superior. White cannot gain tempo by kicking blacks knight on f6. However Dont play it unless you know the principles of the Kings Indian Defense. I had to transpose to the KID many times in my games. For Pirc lovers. The Sicilian Dragon is FAR Superior. Black has the same position as the Pirc. In ADDITION Black has access to the half open c file.

I like how there's a bunch of 1000 rated players going around saying 1 opening is "superior" to another for some random reason. When both openings are played at the highest level.

Engines don't mean s**t in the opening.

That is one problem that many younger generations still do not seem to understand.  Numerical evaluations don't mean jack.  The difference between 7.5 and 0.3 is significant.  White is winning in the first case.  0.2 vs 0.4 vs 0.9?  Does not mean crap in the opening.

The basis is human analysis, statistical data.  And no, not the win percentage based on 1...e6 vs 1...d6 - the win percentages of critical lines by both sides in each opening.

It is time for all you digital maniacs to get back into reality and understand the basics of chess.  You allow White a big center, you are at a disadvantage.  Before you go blurting out Hypermodern, step back and understand the difference between sound hypermodern strategy and dubious strategy.  The Nimzo-Indian is a hypermodern defense as you are using your pieces rather than your pawns to control the center, but you are still fighting for control of it!  You stop e4 early on.  You chip away at d4 early with an early c5 advance, etc.  You are not letting White own the center completely uncontested.  Same thing goes for say, the modern benoni.

Now look at the Pirc.  1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 g6 4.Nf3 Bg7 with moves like c6 and b5 coming, skirting around White's center and never directly attacking it like in the Nimzo or Benoni.

There is a reason that:

1. Critical lines score better for White in secondary defenses like the Alekhine and Pirc and dubious lines like Owen's Defense

2. GMs play the Big 4 against e4 far more than other defenses

3. Certain hypermodern defenses have far more respect at the GM level.  How far you go at waiting to attack the center is critical.  Not occupying the center but disrupting White from getting a dream center, like the Nimzo, Benoni, Queens Indian, etc is like jumping off a 10 foot cliff into a pool of water that is known to be 20 feet deep.  Just freely giving White the center with eventually no room to maneuver is like jumping out of a plane hoping your parachute works and that someone does not have to put in the classifieds "Parachute for Sale!  Never Opened!  Used once!  Slightly stained!"

i dont think you know how to use engines. 0.9 is big difference from 0.4 or even 0.6. They are few openings worth their salt that get evals that high. (when you do see them , they are usually in low depths). 

Even if the eval is that high, you should manually work through the line to see if the eval holds well. IF you do all of that and the engine still giving an atrocious reading, its most likely bad period.

I know how to use engines.  At move 30, yes, 0.9 compared to 0.2 makes a huge difference.

I am pointing out to those others that think their opening is better because the evaluation at an early move is better, like the fool that says the Pirc is evaluated as better than your beloved French, and I am saying what you are saying.  Evaluations by computers early on (meaning IN THE OPENING STAGES) don't mean Jack and .2 vs .9 makes no difference.  5 moves into the Kings Indian it says roughly +1 for White.  If 1.d4 d6 2.e4 e6 3.c4 c6 were to say +0.6, you going to tell me that is more sound than the Kings Indian?  PaLeez!  So the whole point is that numerical evaluations in the opening are worthless horsebleep.  So on the other poster's claim, if 6 moves of the French is 0.7 and 6 moves of the Pirc is 0.6, that does not make the Pirc better like he claims.

Go 20 moves down the most critical line of each defense and then speak to me about numerical values!  Only now does 0.9 mean more than 0.2.  Not at move 5 bozos!

show me an engine  worth its salt that says KID is +1 early on AT HIGH DEPTH

e.g my beloved b4 in the bxb4 main line, engines sometimes go as high as -0.9 especially after the correct 3.c4 but you wait long enough, and the eval reaches valuations close to 0.00 so im not foreign to early depth engine misevualations, but these days, engines can give you depth 40+ (esp stockfish!) in 10-20 minutes if not sooner, thats not an excuse anymore.