Nice! How has this not been discovered before? Might there be some refutation to the Nb4 idea?
New Trap Against the Nimzowitsch-Larsen Attack (For Black)
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Jun 8, 2021
0
#3
AunTheKnight wrote:
Nice! How has this not been discovered before? Might there be some refutation to the Nb4 idea?
After Nb4 if a3 is played then white has a slight advantage, but I'd say it's more likely that you're opponent will get greedy if you play this and just grab the pawn
Jun 8, 2021
0
#4
BlackLawliet wrote:
AunTheKnight wrote:
Nice! How has this not been discovered before? Might there be some refutation to the Nb4 idea?
After Nb4 if a3 is played then white has a slight advantage, but I'd say it's more likely that you're opponent will get greedy if you play this and just grab the pawn
At our level, that would probably happen.
Jun 8, 2021
0
#5
AunTheKnight wrote:
BlackLawliet wrote:
AunTheKnight wrote:
Nice! How has this not been discovered before? Might there be some refutation to the Nb4 idea?
After Nb4 if a3 is played then white has a slight advantage, but I'd say it's more likely that you're opponent will get greedy if you play this and just grab the pawn
At our level, that would probably happen.
Yes, I agree. It's very hard to spot the repercussions of capturing the pawn because even if white spots Bf5, they will probably think that the c2 square is defendable with the move d3
Jun 8, 2021
0
#6
BlackLawliet wrote:
Here is another opening trap I've made for a line in the Nimzowitsch-Larsen attack with the black pieces:
All of the moves in the position above have been played before, but there is a move in this position, there is a move which sets up a trap:
Nb4! And with this move comes a cunning idea. First, if white's bishop takes the e-pawn it leads to a slightly better position for black:
But if white plays cxd5 first:
And in this position, if white's bishop is moved out of harm's way, O-O-O would be absolutely devastating. That is the most realistic line to happen in my opinion, but according to the engine the best line to play after cxd5 is this:
If you read this please leave a comment on what you think. Thank you!
seems like a loss of a tempo to me, a3 after Nb4 and white is slightly better ig. I mean i get the idea, if white is greedy, but this shouldn't be good, since the nimzo-larsen isn't really that good in the first place, and there are better lines than this
Jun 8, 2021
0
#7
aMazeMove wrote:
BlackLawliet wrote:
Here is another opening trap I've made for a line in the Nimzowitsch-Larsen attack with the black pieces:
All of the moves in the position above have been played before, but there is a move in this position, there is a move which sets up a trap:
Nb4! And with this move comes a cunning idea. First, if white's bishop takes the e-pawn it leads to a slightly better position for black:
But if white plays cxd5 first:
And in this position, if white's bishop is moved out of harm's way, O-O-O would be absolutely devastating. That is the most realistic line to happen in my opinion, but according to the engine the best line to play after cxd5 is this:
If you read this please leave a comment on what you think. Thank you!
seems like a loss of a tempo to me, a3 after Nb4 and white is slightly better ig. I mean i get the idea, if white is greedy, but this shouldn't be good, since the nimzo-larsen isn't really that good in the first place, and there are better lines than this
At your level, you're probably correct, but players at my level are super greedy and don't hesitate to take the pawn. I also think i's a bad mindset to have to say that just because there are better lines, you shouldn't play this one. For example, if this is the way that people thought then the hyper-accelerated Dragon variation of the Sicilian would never be played because according to engines it is bad. But either way obviously as highly as you're rated it may not be your best option.
Jun 8, 2021
0
#8
BlackLawliet wrote:
aMazeMove wrote:
BlackLawliet wrote:
Here is another opening trap I've made for a line in the Nimzowitsch-Larsen attack with the black pieces:
All of the moves in the position above have been played before, but there is a move in this position, there is a move which sets up a trap:
Nb4! And with this move comes a cunning idea. First, if white's bishop takes the e-pawn it leads to a slightly better position for black:
But if white plays cxd5 first:
And in this position, if white's bishop is moved out of harm's way, O-O-O would be absolutely devastating. That is the most realistic line to happen in my opinion, but according to the engine the best line to play after cxd5 is this:
If you read this please leave a comment on what you think. Thank you!
seems like a loss of a tempo to me, a3 after Nb4 and white is slightly better ig. I mean i get the idea, if white is greedy, but this shouldn't be good, since the nimzo-larsen isn't really that good in the first place, and there are better lines than this
At your level, you're probably correct, but players at my level are super greedy and don't hesitate to take the pawn. I also think i's a bad mindset to have to say that just because there are better lines, you shouldn't play this one. For example, if this is the way that people thought then the hyper-accelerated Dragon variation of the Sicilian would never be played because according to engines it is bad. But either way obviously as highly as you're rated it may not be your best option.
i mean well at my level, nobody plays this cause they know it's bad
Jun 8, 2021
0
#9
aMazeMove wrote:
BlackLawliet wrote:
aMazeMove wrote:
BlackLawliet wrote:
Here is another opening trap I've made for a line in the Nimzowitsch-Larsen attack with the black pieces:
All of the moves in the position above have been played before, but there is a move in this position, there is a move which sets up a trap:
Nb4! And with this move comes a cunning idea. First, if white's bishop takes the e-pawn it leads to a slightly better position for black:
But if white plays cxd5 first:
And in this position, if white's bishop is moved out of harm's way, O-O-O would be absolutely devastating. That is the most realistic line to happen in my opinion, but according to the engine the best line to play after cxd5 is this:
If you read this please leave a comment on what you think. Thank you!
seems like a loss of a tempo to me, a3 after Nb4 and white is slightly better ig. I mean i get the idea, if white is greedy, but this shouldn't be good, since the nimzo-larsen isn't really that good in the first place, and there are better lines than this
At your level, you're probably correct, but players at my level are super greedy and don't hesitate to take the pawn. I also think i's a bad mindset to have to say that just because there are better lines, you shouldn't play this one. For example, if this is the way that people thought then the hyper-accelerated Dragon variation of the Sicilian would never be played because according to engines it is bad. But either way obviously as highly as you're rated it may not be your best option.
i mean well at my level, nobody plays this cause they know it's bad
Do you mean the opening b3, or the trap?
Jun 8, 2021
0
#10
BlackLawliet wrote:
aMazeMove wrote:
BlackLawliet wrote:
aMazeMove wrote:
BlackLawliet wrote:
Here is another opening trap I've made for a line in the Nimzowitsch-Larsen attack with the black pieces:
All of the moves in the position above have been played before, but there is a move in this position, there is a move which sets up a trap:
Nb4! And with this move comes a cunning idea. First, if white's bishop takes the e-pawn it leads to a slightly better position for black:
But if white plays cxd5 first:
And in this position, if white's bishop is moved out of harm's way, O-O-O would be absolutely devastating. That is the most realistic line to happen in my opinion, but according to the engine the best line to play after cxd5 is this:
If you read this please leave a comment on what you think. Thank you!
seems like a loss of a tempo to me, a3 after Nb4 and white is slightly better ig. I mean i get the idea, if white is greedy, but this shouldn't be good, since the nimzo-larsen isn't really that good in the first place, and there are better lines than this
At your level, you're probably correct, but players at my level are super greedy and don't hesitate to take the pawn. I also think i's a bad mindset to have to say that just because there are better lines, you shouldn't play this one. For example, if this is the way that people thought then the hyper-accelerated Dragon variation of the Sicilian would never be played because according to engines it is bad. But either way obviously as highly as you're rated it may not be your best option.
i mean well at my level, nobody plays this cause they know it's bad
Do you mean the opening b3, or the trap?
the trap. but even the opening b3 is not common
I agree that the opening of b3 is not common, but these are interesting lines. It all does depend on white being greedy rather than just playing solid. It is an interesting idea, but I think it would only be relevant in lower-level games or possible faster time controls. I do see the draw to these positions, but it will likely never come up and white can be perfectly fine if they play it correctly.
Jun 8, 2021
0
#12
jexjp wrote:
I agree that the opening of b3 is not common, but these are interesting lines. It all does depend on white being greedy rather than just playing solid. It is an interesting idea, but I think it would only be relevant in lower-level games or possible faster time controls. I do see the draw to these positions, but it will likely never come up and white can be perfectly fine if they play it correctly.
I agree, but if even if white does play very well, it's unlikely that white will gain almost any advantage, so I think it's worth a try
Jun 8, 2021
0
#13
pfren wrote:
4...Nb4 is the definition of a dumb move.
After 5.a3 the horsie has to return to c6, when white has gained a lot of time for nothing.
This is much closer to an "epic black failure" than a "slight advantage to white" as has been described.
the OP is talking about with lower rated players, how they might get greedy to take the e5 pawn, but i agree this is just dumb
Jun 8, 2021
0
#14
pfren wrote:
4...Nb4 is the definition of a dumb move.
After 5.a3 the horsie has to return to c6, when white has gained a lot of time for nothing.
This is much closer to an "epic black failure" than a "slight advantage to white" as has been described.
I'd say that "epic black failure" is a bit of a dramatizaton. It is less than +1 for white
Jun 8, 2021
0
#15
Elaborating on my last comment, the Stafford gambit is marked as +1.40 for white. Would you call this an epic fail? If so, it was popularized by another IM who is just as strong as you (Eric Rosen).
Jun 9, 2021
0
#16
what are third rate openings?
first rate are mainlines i think
second rate and third rate? examples?
also yes that is the brooklyn variation
Jun 9, 2021
0
#17
BlackLawliet wrote:
Elaborating on my last comment, the Stafford gambit is marked as +1.40 for white. Would you call this an epic fail? If so, it was popularized by another IM who is just as strong as you (Eric Rosen).
ok, you're line is dubious, just like the stafford or brooklyn. No trap is really good, since most of the time, the opponent has the fall into it. If you stop trying to develop dubious traps, I think you would find that you have a lot of free time to do something else more productive.
Jun 9, 2021
0
#18
most
some traps are like the milner barry
a sound opening with a potential trap
Jun 9, 2021
0
#19
In the OP's second-to-last diagram, just take the Knight!
After 11...Rd8 12.Qxd8+ Kxd8 13.Bxe5 (13...Qg5+ is answered by 14.f4), White has Rook, Bishop, and Knight for Queen and Pawn.
Also, this will almost never happen! White does not play 4.c4 if they know what they are doing. It is 4.Bb5 Bd6 and only now 5.c4 or 5.f4 (personal preference - one is not better than the other).
Jun 9, 2021
0
#20
ThrillerFan wrote:
In the OP's second-to-last diagram, just take the Knight!
After 11...Rd8 12.Qxd8+ Kxd8 13.Bxe5 (13...Qg5+ is answered by 14.f4), White has Rook, Bishop, and Knight for Queen and Pawn.
Also, this will almost never happen! White does not play 4.c4 if they know what they are doing. It is 4.Bb5 Bd6 and only now 5.c4 or 5.f4 (personal preference - one is not better than the other).
c4 is not a bad move, i play it, trying to get into a reverse sicilian. but Nb4 after c4 is not good
Here is another opening trap I've made for a line in the Nimzowitsch-Larsen attack with the black pieces:
All of the moves in the position above have been played before, but there is a move in this position, there is a move which sets up a trap:
Nb4! And with this move comes a cunning idea. First, if white's bishop takes the e-pawn it leads to a slightly better position for black:
But if white plays cxd5 first:
And in this position, if white's bishop is moved out of harm's way, O-O-O would be absolutely devastating. That is the most realistic line to happen in my opinion, but according to the engine the best line to play after cxd5 is this:
If you read this please leave a comment on what you think. Thank you!