I still play Alekhine. And it works fine. So just make it one of your answers to 1.e4 (it is always wise to have two, so 1..e5 could still be a choice) and you will be able to use it for the rest of your life.
The Alekhine's Defence and my thoughts on playing uncommon openings on an intermediate level.
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The short answer is yes. You can profit from all sorts of things in intermediate that you would get heavily penalized for at higher levels. Most gambits and other sharp openings are a good example of openings that can be very dangerous at lower levels while at higher levels they are almost a loss already.
Sep 29, 2021
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#4
Uhohspaghettio1 wrote:
The short answer is yes. You can profit from all sorts of things in intermediate that you would get heavily penalized for at higher levels. Most gambits and other sharp openings are a good example of openings that can be very dangerous at lower levels while at higher levels they are almost a loss already.
We are talking about a viable secondary defense here, not an unsound gambit!
Sep 29, 2021
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#5
Galse22 wrote:
About 3 months ago I started playing chess again. I played a lot of 1. e5 as black against 1. e4, but playing the Guioco Piano or the Morphy's defense got kind of boring so I looked into new responses against 1. e4. I tried playing the Sicilian for a bit, but I just felt it was too much theory. I also tried to play the Scandinavian, but I never was able to get an Icelandic Gambit. And then I found the Alekhine's defense ( 1. e4, black responds with nf6?! ), which provokes the white's pawns to go forward and overextend. In my 863 games of 1. e4 as white, I myself had only faced the Alekhine's defense 21 times. I've looked into it and honestly even though it is one of the most insane-looking openings for giving white a huge center, it is so uncommon that almost no one at my level ( 1400-1500 ) knows how to play against it and I have a 57% win rate with a BLACK OPENING. Due to this, I honestly believe that uncommon but somewhat viable openings are very good at an intermediate level mostly because your opponents do not know what to play against you. What are your thoughts on the Alekhine's Defense and other uncommon openings?
you can play the Alekhine defense for the rest of your chess career just fine, if you are hoping to one day reach the stronger master ranks, it probably shoudnt be your primary defense, if only because you make it easier for players to prepare something nasty agaisnt you (this is the problem with a lot of secondary defenses, many critical lines follow very narrow corridors,, so you opponent can prepare a lethal novelty you may not practically respond well agaisnt even if the engine isnt impressed).
Hypermodern defenses are super fun though, if you start playing them a lot, you will get used to getting decisive games where one side has a decisive advantage before the endgame. This ironically, is why for my rating i was weak in the endgame for quite a while i simply always won in the middlegame agaisnt weaker opposition.
stronger players that love these offbeat openings often play a bunch of them as a pack,this way preparing agaisnt you is not as fruitful, since finding a novelty in move 15 of one your openings may prove useless if you play defense #3 or opening #5 in your arsenal
Sep 29, 2021
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#6
It's definitely a lot of fun to play, and is very effective if you know what you're doing, but you can't just play principled moves and expect to get a good position.
You have to learn very specific move orders, pawn structures (my Alekhine repertoire forces me to know at least the Caro, Advance French, and Sicilian structures), maneuvers (n6d7 instead of n8d7 to be allowed to play n8f6 instead), and ugly pawn breaks (f6 in the 4 Pawns (I didn't even know about this until recently)) in order to get anything from it.
I haven't been able to learn all that stuff yet even though it is my primary choice right now vs 1. e4
Sep 29, 2021
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#7
Toldsted wrote:
I still play Alekhine. And it works fine. So just make it one of your answers to 1.e4 (it is always wise to have two, so 1..e5 could still be a choice) and you will be able to use it for the rest of your life.
There is no need for two responses to 1.e4. I play 1...e6 exclusively now. I play pretty much any line except the Burn and Closed Tarrasch. I'll play the Winawer (7...Qc7, 7...O-O, 7...Kf8), McCutchen, Classical, Rubinstein, etc against 3.Nc3. Against 3.Nd2, just about any 3...c5 line along with an occaisonal 3...Be7.
Why study two whole different openings? Expand within the opening you play!
blueemu wrote:
If you are playing that game with black, you almost always pin that knight whenever it comes out to f3, if white plays the two pawn attack ( c and e pawns pushed ) or c, d, and e pawns pushed, it can get very hard for them to get unpinned.
DasBurner wrote:
It's definitely a lot of fun to play, and is very effective if you know what you're doing, but you can't just play principled moves and expect to get a good position.
You have to learn very specific move orders, pawn structures (my Alekhine repertoire forces me to know at least the Caro, Advance French, and Sicilian structures), maneuvers (n6d7 instead of n8d7 to be allowed to play n8f6 instead), and ugly pawn breaks (f6 in the 4 Pawns (I didn't even know about this until recently)) in order to get anything from it.
I haven't been able to learn all that stuff yet even though it is my primary choice right now vs 1. e4"
Yeah against the Advance Scandi variation of the Alekhine it can turn out as an advance french and sometimes you can trade c for d pawns or c for e pawns ( sideline on the exchange variation of the Alekhine right? ) not sure if I ever got myself into any Caro-Kann like structures, although I must admit I do not know a lot about the Caro as I am Queens Gambit Player ( 1. d4 ), so Caro games invitation turn into Slavs.
darkunorthodox88 wrote:
Hypermodern defenses are super fun though, if you start playing them a lot, you will get used to getting decisive games where one side has a decisive advantage before the endgame. This ironically, is why for my rating i was weak in the endgame for quite a while i simply always won in the middlegame agaisnt weaker opposition.
I completely agree. Playing them is super fun but I hate playing against them, specifically whenever I get Grünfelded.
Sep 29, 2021
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#12
Galse22 wrote:
If you are playing that game with black, you almost ways pin that knight whenever it comes out to f3, if white plays the two pawn attack ( c and e pawns pushed ) or c, d, and e pawns pushed, it can get very hard for them to get unpinned.
4. ... g6 is a perfectly respectable line. It's the 2nd most common move in that position, 60% as common as Bg4.
blueemu wrote:
Galse22 wrote:
If you are playing that game with black, you almost ways pin that knight whenever it comes out to f3, if white plays the two pawn attack ( c and e pawns pushed ) or c, d, and e pawns pushed, it can get very hard for them to get unpinned.
4. ... g6 is a perfectly respectable line. It's the 2nd most common move in that position, 60% as common as Bg4.
I feel like it weakens the light squares too much. You can very quickly get checkmated or have to sac material because of, for example, a Qf7 mate threat supported by the pawn.
#1
"What are your thoughts on the Alekhine's Defense and other uncommon openings?"
Alekhine's Defence is dubious in the sense that it probably loses in ICCF correspondence. However, Fischer played it twice in his 1972 World Championship match against Spassky. GM Bagirov played it almost exclusively. You have to like the cramped positions it leads to.
Sep 30, 2021
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#15
ThrillerFan skrev:
There is no need for two responses to 1.e4.
Why study two whole different openings? Expand within the opening you play!
I recommend two (preferably quite different) answers to 1.e4 (and 1.d4). It is of course more work, but the advantage is that you can send one of the openings to repair. Additional advantages: you are harder to prepare for and you have a better chance to direct the game in your wanted direction: sharp or calm.
Why repair? A painful loss in your favorite variant or a game where Magnus crushes your favorite variant often means that you do not want to play it again right away. Sometimes it needs to really be repaired, other times you just need to have your emotions cooled. But in either case, it's nice to have your alternative in stock.
people know no theory against it and you will often have good positions! just a question: I'm an intermediate player (1950 l*chess, I don't really play on chess.com a lot) and I know my theory so I chose the Modern Variation against the Alekhine (1 e4 Nf6 2 e5 Nd5 3 d4 d6 4 Nf3) do you have anything prepared against this? Would you like the resulting positions for black? I still believe your opponents will almost never play like this but if you dislike the second main-line of your opening then I think you should be questioning it again
Sep 30, 2021
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#17
The problem as White with the fine and solid 1.e4 Nf6 2.e5 Nd5 3.d4 d6 4.Nf3 is you have to be prepared for many different Black continuations: 4...Bg4, 4...Nc6, 4...dxe5, 4...g6, 4...Nb6, 4...c6, 4...Bf5 and maybe even more.
Toldsted I know but since I have a full repertoire course by a Super GM I want to profit from it the most. Learning the 4 pawns attack is impractical as its very risky and learning something so theoretical against a Defense I face roughly once out of 60 games seems stupid, everything else seems too soft and the Modern variation offers a solid but long-term advantage
Sep 30, 2021
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#19
ConfusedGhoul wrote:
Toldsted I know but since I have a full repertoire course by a Super GM I want to profit from it the most. Learning the 4 pawns attack is impractical as its very risky and learning something so theoretical against a Defense I face roughly once out of 60 games seems stupid, everything else seems too soft and the Modern variation offers a solid but long-term advantage
You could just transpose into some other opening.
About 3 months ago I started playing chess again. I played a lot of 1. e5 as black against 1. e4, but playing the Guioco Piano or the Morphy's defense got kind of boring so I looked into new responses against 1. e4. I tried playing the Sicilian for a bit, but I just felt it was too much theory. I also tried to play the Scandinavian, but I never was able to get an Icelandic Gambit. And then I found the Alekhine's defense ( 1. e4, black responds with nf6?! ), which provokes the white's pawns to go forward and overextend. In my 863 games of 1. e4 as white, I myself had only faced the Alekhine's defense 21 times. I've looked into it and honestly even though it is one of the most insane-looking openings for giving white a huge center, it is so uncommon that almost no one at my level ( 1400-1500 ) knows how to play against it and I have a 57% win rate with a BLACK OPENING. Due to this, I honestly believe that uncommon but somewhat viable openings are very good at an intermediate level mostly because your opponents do not know what to play against you. What are your thoughts on the Alekhine's Defense and other uncommon openings?