Who is the greatest chess player of all time ?? Bobby Fischer ??

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alinfe
jambyvedar wrote:
LeeTaylor85 wrote:

According to several different engines analyses, Fischer was the most accurate player, also the the strongest over a one year period.

 

No. Current engine ranks Carlsen as the most accurate. Chess.com stuff made this engine analysis few months ago.

No, all engine analyses done to date EXCEPT chess.com's CAPS rank Fischer higher than Kasparov or anybody else to that date. It's true Carlsen was not included since he was too young at the time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_top_chess_players_throughout_history

null

 

You do have to realize CAPS is a proprietary solution belonging to chess.com, so it's hard to tell what goes on under the hood so to speak. And even CAPS initially declared Fischer slightly more accurate than Kasparov, only to revert later without much explanation...

mcris
jambyvedar wrote:
mcris wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
mcris wrote:

Not counting his matches with Karpov (fixed in Fischer's oppinion), Kasparov broke with FIDE in 1993 ... So, from a FIDE standpoint, Kasparov never (succesfully) defended his title.

I do not remember ever hearing of FIDE adopting the Fischer opinion.

Which part of "Not counting..." you didn't understand?

 

An opinion. Now lets go to the facts, Kasparov defended his FIDE world championship against Karpov.

Cannot you read? Fischer, an expert player, possibly the best, analysed those games for 2 years and concluded they were fixed. In 2002 Kasparov played a match with Karpov and lost (also written in my post).

kindaspongey
mcris wrote:

... Fischer, an expert player, possibly the best, analysed those games for 2 years and concluded they were fixed. ...

How many GMs have said that we should accept Fischer's assessment?

jambyvedar
alinfe wrote:
jambyvedar wrote:
LeeTaylor85 wrote:

According to several different engines analyses, Fischer was the most accurate player, also the the strongest over a one year period.

 

No. Current engine ranks Carlsen as the most accurate. Chess.com stuff made this engine analysis few months ago.

No, all engine analyses done to date EXCEPT chess.com's CAPS rank Fischer higher than Kasparov or anybody else to that date. It's true Carlsen was not included since he was too young at the time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_top_chess_players_throughout_history

 

 

You do have to realize CAPS is a proprietary solution belonging to chess.com, so it's hard to tell what goes on under the hood so to speak. And even CAPS initially declared Fischer slightly more accurate than Kasparov, only to revert later without much explanation...

 

Those are not the latest engine. Latest engine used by chess.com resulted in Carlsen as the most accurate.

jambyvedar
mcris wrote:
jambyvedar wrote:
mcris wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
mcris wrote:

Not counting his matches with Karpov (fixed in Fischer's oppinion), Kasparov broke with FIDE in 1993 ... So, from a FIDE standpoint, Kasparov never (succesfully) defended his title.

I do not remember ever hearing of FIDE adopting the Fischer opinion.

Which part of "Not counting..." you didn't understand?

 

An opinion. Now lets go to the facts, Kasparov defended his FIDE world championship against Karpov.

Cannot you read? Fischer, an expert player, possibly the best, analysed those games for 2 years and concluded they were fixed. In 2002 Kasparov played a match with Karpov and lost (also written in my post).

 

 And people knows Fischer has a troubled mind.    And as one poster here told, how many GMs told that we should accept Fischer's opinion? Yeah Kasparov lost to Karpov in that match. So what? You can't win all the time. Kasparov beat Karpov in a match in 2009.

 

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl?tid=69871

fabelhaft

"all engine analyses done to date EXCEPT chess.com's CAPS rank Fischer higher than Kasparov or anybody else to that date"

Of course not...

fabelhaft

null

 

http://en.chessbase.com/post/the-quality-of-play-at-the-candidates-090413

fabelhaft

Another engine analysis here, as most of them with Fischer behind some other players

http://en.chessbase.com/post/computers-choose-who-was-the-strongest-player-

 

niceforkinmove

Do you mean who played the best moves?  Then I think computers would be the best judge of that.  Here is an attempt at that before Carlsen became dominant so it doesn't really cover him:

http://en.chessbase.com/post/computers-choose-who-was-the-strongest-player-

 

 

If you mean who was strongest versus players of their time then I guess ratings would be good to decide that.   But that may just as well be a matter of having a weak field at a given time as being actual strength.  

 

If you mean who advanced the game the most.  Well then its pretty clear, Morphy did that.  happy.png 

 

edit:  I see Fabelhaft has some other analysis of games.  I have not gotten into the nitty gritty of which is better.  But the overall gist seems similar.   

mcris
kindaspongey wrote:
mcris wrote:

... Fischer, an expert player, possibly the best, analysed those games for 2 years and concluded they were fixed. ...

How many GMs have said that we should accept Fischer's assessment?

At least one: https://www.chess.com/blog/Spektrowski/the-conspiracies-of-valery-salov-part-2

@jambyvedar: Fischer had a troubled destiny, don't blame his mind.

fewlio

Fischer is truly, the GOAT!

jambyvedar
mcris wrote:
kindaspongey wrote:
mcris wrote:

... Fischer, an expert player, possibly the best, analysed those games for 2 years and concluded they were fixed. ...

How many GMs have said that we should accept Fischer's assessment?

At least one: https://www.chess.com/blog/Spektrowski/the-conspiracies-of-valery-salov-part-2

@jambyvedar: Fischer had a troubled destiny, don't blame his mind.

At least one. What Fischer told is an opinion and not a fact.

jambyvedar
fewlio wrote:

Fischer is truly, the GOAT!

The GOAT in your opinion(from USA). For me Kasparov is the GOAT and I am not from Russia.

gustavtropolo

U will find out in this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHeQUgUOoRs

fewlio
jambyvedar wrote:
fewlio wrote:

Fischer is truly, the GOAT!

The GOAT in your opinion(from USA). For me Kasparov is the GOAT and I am not from Russia.

 

kasparov had a shot, but unfortunately choked and lost to Deep Blue

jambyvedar
fewlio wrote:
jambyvedar wrote:
fewlio wrote:

Fischer is truly, the GOAT!

The GOAT in your opinion(from USA). For me Kasparov is the GOAT and I am not from Russia.

 

kasparov had a shot, but unfortunately choked and lost to Deep Blue

And? Everybody loses.  That defeat did not erased Kasparov's accomplishment.

alinfe
fewlio wrote:
jambyvedar wrote:
fewlio wrote:

Fischer is truly, the GOAT!

The GOAT in your opinion(from USA). For me Kasparov is the GOAT and I am not from Russia.

 

kasparov had a shot, but unfortunately choked and lost to Deep Blue

not only that, but he might be the only world champion to lose the title without a single victory.

To keep everybody happy, Fischer is the GOAT and Kasparov is the goat :D

alinfe
fabelhaft wrote:

Another engine analysis here, as most of them with Fischer behind some other players

http://en.chessbase.com/post/computers-choose-who-was-the-strongest-player-

 

A 2008 analysis, using Rybka 3, showed that Capablanca had the smallest average error factor (i.e. the most accurate play); but after adjusting for factors such as the complexity of positions, the best player came out as Fischer, followed by Capablanca, Karpov and Kramnik. The best players had an average error of about 0.07 pawns per move (after the opening). Capablanca was the most positional player, and Anand by far the most tactical. The most complex game tested was Fischer v Spassky (1972 game 6, Fischer won) while the most accurately played game was Tal v Benko (1958, Tal won): https://www.scribd.com/doc/132380754/Chess-Player-Analysis-by-Rybka-3-14ply

captnding123

ME

fabelhaft
alinfe wrote:
fewlio wrote:
jambyvedar wrote:
fewlio wrote:

Fischer is truly, the GOAT!

The GOAT in your opinion(from USA). For me Kasparov is the GOAT and I am not from Russia.

 

kasparov had a shot, but unfortunately choked and lost to Deep Blue

not only that, but he might be the only world champion to lose the title without a single victory.

Kasparov, Lasker and Anand all did the same, but measuring greatness isn't as simple as that... 

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