Why lose points on drawn games?

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ShriQueen

 

I don't think it is fair to lose/gain rating just for a drawn game (unless the side losing stalemates they should win rating).

For example, past week, I was playing my friend, but they mouse-slipped. They requested me a draw offer, yet when accepted it,(even though I was winning) I lost rating.

This doesn't make any sense to just lose rating for a drawn game! In my opinion, this is extremely unfair.

SacrificeTheHorse

The rating change is based on your opponents rating. If you are rated higher you are expected to win and they are expected to lose, therefore if you draw you will lose rating and they will gain rating. A stalemate is also simply a draw where the same conditions apply - it makes no difference if you draw a tough and completely equal game after 70 moves or if you are up 3 Queens and blunder stalemate. If you are playing casual games vs your friends where you are happy to accept a draw after a mouseslip it would be better to play unrated.

Aavahan-Beta

yeah

 

Jalex13
If a 500 manages a draw against a 2000 I think that would deserve a couple points. If I was in that situation, I would consider it a win.
Mike_Kalish

I believe the game is worth 16 points, and they are allocated anywhere from 8/8 to 0/16. If you are playing someone way lower than you, you may get 0 ratings points for winning, and you might lose 8 for a draw, whereas it will be the opposite for them.  If you play someone of equal rating, it's 8 points for a win, -8 for a loss, and 0 for a draw.  

zone_chess

This is typical low-rated behavior. You confuse fraternizing with playing chess.
Chess is combat.
No playing ms. nice girl. Just win when you can win. Mouse slip? You win. Stupid queen blunder? Their problem, no takebacks - you win. That's the way people learn to get better quicker. Chess at high levels is way more ruthless. You can do it!

Everything is fair as long as it is legal.
And real friends will stay friends no matter what, no worries happy.png

Gyryth1

If you think rating points are more important than good manners, then chess is the game for you!  

Duck

If you drew against a grandmaster, wouldn't you want to be rewarded for it? 

Jalex13
What? Lol
Chan_Fry
mikekalish wrote:

I believe the game is worth 16 points, and they are allocated anywhere from 8/8 to 0/16. If you are playing someone way lower than you, you may get 0 ratings points for winning, and you might lose 8 for a draw, whereas it will be the opposite for them.  If you play someone of equal rating, it's 8 points for a win, -8 for a loss, and 0 for a draw.  

I've seen this 16-point idea floated in these forums before, but it simply isn't true. It depends on several factors, including the rating of both players but also the glicko rd number (how confident the site is that your rating is accurate).

 

Example: recently, I drew against my brother and he gained 80-something points (because his rating was much lower than mine, and his glicko rd was a big number).

Mike_Kalish
Chan_Fry wrote:
mikekalish wrote:

I believe the game is worth 16 points, and they are allocated anywhere from 8/8 to 0/16. If you are playing someone way lower than you, you may get 0 ratings points for winning, and you might lose 8 for a draw, whereas it will be the opposite for them.  If you play someone of equal rating, it's 8 points for a win, -8 for a loss, and 0 for a draw.  

I've seen this 16-point idea floated in these forums before, but it simply isn't true. It depends on several factors, including the rating of both players but also the glicko rd number (how confident the site is that your rating is accurate).

 

Example: recently, I drew against my brother and he gained 80-something points (because his rating was much lower than mine, and his glicko rd was a big number).

Well, I wasn't "floating an idea". Every game I play, the allocation of points is shown, so I always know what is at stake. And the points allocated to me and my opponent always totals 16 depending on our relative ratings. No one has ever told me this is how it's done, but every time the game starts, I look to see how many ratings points I can win or lose, and that's what I see. +7 / -9   or  +10 / -6.  or  even +16 / 0.

ShriQueen
Gyryth1 wrote:

If you think rating points are more important than good manners, then chess is the game for you!  

I do not sad.png

ShriQueen
ScatteredWealth wrote:

If you drew against a grandmaster, wouldn't you want to be rewarded for it? 

Makes sense now. BTW, WHAT!? HOW!?!?!?!

ShriQueen
zone_chess wrote:

This is typical low-rated behavior. You confuse fraternizing with playing chess.
Chess is combat.
No playing ms. nice girl. Just win when you can win. Mouse slip? You win. Stupid queen blunder? Their problem, no takebacks - you win. That's the way people learn to get better quicker. Chess at high levels is way more ruthless. You can do it!

Everything is fair as long as it is legal.
And real friends will stay friends no matter what, no worries

Also, I usually play on Lichess.org and I used chess.com when I was a beginner who could be scholars mated, so please don't think i'm that low rated 😅. I'm actually a 1500 on Lichess.org happy.png

Chan_Fry
Chan_Fry wrote:

Example: recently, I drew against my brother and he gained 80-something points (because his rating was much lower than mine, and his glicko rd was a big number).

In order to be certain, I went back and checked. He gained 95 points for the draw, and I lost six points. This is as it should be. I had mate in two, and as a 1300+ player, I should have seen it, but instead stalemated.

ChessDude009
ShriQueen wrote:
zone_chess wrote:

This is typical low-rated behavior. You confuse fraternizing with playing chess.
Chess is combat.
No playing ms. nice girl. Just win when you can win. Mouse slip? You win. Stupid queen blunder? Their problem, no takebacks - you win. That's the way people learn to get better quicker. Chess at high levels is way more ruthless. You can do it!

Everything is fair as long as it is legal.
And real friends will stay friends no matter what, no worries

Also, I usually play on Lichess.org and I used chess.com when I was a beginner who could be scholars mated, so please don't think i'm that low rated 😅. I'm actually a 1500 on Lichess.org

I doubt anyone here would invalidate an argument with their rating as proof.

In other words, don't worry.

Aavahan-Beta
ShriQueen wrote:
Gyryth1 wrote:

If you think rating points are more important than good manners, then chess is the game for you!  

I do not

i agree. i wouldn't think rating points are more important than good manners. you could probably be reported if you had bad manners

Mike_Kalish

The only people who really think chess is combat are people who have never been in combat. 

DreamscapeHorizons

Imagine if u were rated 1000 and u played a 10 game match with an opponent rated 500. The expected score would be something like 95% in ur favor but all the games are drawn. So the final score is 5 - 5. Since u only scored 50% and were expected to score 95% don't u think ur rating should drop a bit while ur opponent should gain rating? 

macfeej
Imagine that, somehow, someone who has played chess for less than a week draws Kasparov. That would basically be a defeat for the legend, as he is the best player of all time. It’s kind of an extreme example, but that’s how it works