Bishop and knight trade for rook?

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medievalchess

Is it a good to trade a rook for a knight and a bishop. The computer used it against me in hard mode, but I don't know if I would do it myself in a game. Thoughts?

TheOldReb

Yes, in most positions 2 minor pieces are stronger than one rook .

 


Etienne

Position, position and position.

 

But usually one if you trade your rook for an opponent's bishop and knight, I'd take the two minor pieces in general. But usually there's a pawn that comes with the rook, so if you add the pawn in the bargain it really depends on the position.


likesforests

I would almost always give up a rook to win a bishop and knight.


Patzer24
In the case of when your opponent is castled and you take twice on f2 or f7 it usually favors the side getting the two minor pieces for the rook and pawn.
kgbheadlock

Here's the points that pieces are worth

pawn=1, knight/bishop=3 rook=5 queen=9

 2 knights are better than a rook in early game and middle game but it is better to have a rook in end game only if there are not a lot of pawns


likesforests

 2 knights are better than a rook in early game and middle game but it is better to have a rook in end game only if there are not a lot of pawns

 

In the case of Rook vs Bishop & Knight with equal pawns though, even in the endgame the minor pieces usually do better. Flear did a survey in "Practical Endgame Play" showing the rook winning 0, drawing 10, and losing 22 games.


mxdplay4
Two minor pieces are better normally. They can attack the same square twice. With a pawn as well they are better.
Creg
In general, assuming all things are equal positionally the answer is yes, and it comes down to simple math. Excluding the pawns and kings, both players have 8 pieces. To give up one rook to gain two minor pieces is well worth it. Now you only need trade down equally until you have one piece left on the board, and your opponent has none. Though don't do this with a queen.Laughing
Sprite

I'm mixed.  I feel it all depends on the position.  Often times there's another factor in these trades...like strong attack/what have you. 

The one game I did trade bishop and knight for rook, I ended up winning!
(not saying that's a good enough reason why to do it)


medievalchess
Thank you all for your responses. I will definitely use them when playing. This is something I wanted to know, so many thanks :D
testaaaaa

3+3>5

Armaan30
Usually a bishop and knight are better but it depends on the position
Richard_Hunter

2 pieces are better than one. It's double the pleasure and triple the fun.

madratter7

If you count like Yusupov, it is even a better deal, 4.5 for the rook vs 6 for the minor pieces. In fact, it is often worth giving up a Rook and a pawn to capture the two minor pieces. (4.5 + 1 vs 3 + 3).

 

That said, it really depends heavily on the position. If your rook is active and you are capturing a bad bishop, the side losing the two minor pieces may be quite happy with the trade.

NolsterbuckrXY

In the early game where your opponent is gunning for your f7 square with both a bishop and a knight, after castling you're basically trading two active pieces for a semi-active one. I think you could come up with a nice counterattack following that with active pieces.

quadibloc
medievalchess wrote:

Is it a good to trade a rook for a knight and a bishop.

Traditionally, a rook is worth 5 points, and a knight and bishop are worth 3 points. So you gain 1 point worth of material by this trade.

In practice, though, it's a questionable trade, because it's a lot easier to force checkmate with a rook than with a bishop and a knight. The rook, therefore, is vastly easier to put to effective use.

A lot, of course, depends on when this is happening in the game, and what kind of position there is.

OverseasTeacher21

I’d trade my rook.

You can see how it played out in my favor in this game. Even ignoring my opponent’s late game blunder, I had him on the ropes from that point on. 

[Site "Chess.com iPhone"]
[Date "10/15/2021 08:45AM"]
[FEN rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQkq - 0 1]
[White "OverseasTeacher21"]
[Black "Pijounta"]
[Result "OverseasTeacher21 wins by Resignation"]
[WhiteElo "1210"]
[BlackElo "1214"]

1.e4 {9:49} e5 {9:57} 2.Nf3 {9:47} Nc6 {9:56} 3.Be2 {9:40} Nf6 {9:54} 4.Nc3 {9:32} Bc5 {9:50} 5.O-O {9:29} Ng4 {9:49} 6.d3 {9:08} Bxf2+ {9:42} 7.Rxf2 {9:06} Nxf2 {9:41} 8.Kxf2 {9:06} O-O {9:40} 9.Be3 {8:55} d5 {9:34} 10.Nxd5 {8:52} Ne7 {9:05} 11.Nc3 {8:45} Ng6 {9:02} 12.d4 {8:35} Nf4 {8:57} 13.Nxe5 {8:26} Qf6 {8:45} 14.Nf3 {8:17} Nxe2 {8:42} 15.Qxe2 {8:15} Bg4 {8:41} 16.h3 {8:13} Bxf3 {8:39} 17.Qxf3 {8:12} Qb6 {8:32} 18.b3 {8:03} Qc6 {8:27} 19.Bd2 {7:56} Rad8 {8:23} 20.d5 {7:53} Qc5+ {8:21} 21.Qe3 {7:48} Qd6 {8:11} 22.Qxa7 {7:45} f5 {8:05} 23.Qxb7 {7:36} fxe4+ {8:03} 24.Kg1 {7:00} Qc5+ {7:56} 25.Kh1 {6:52} Rxd5 {7:55} 26.Nxd5 {6:50} Qxc2 {7:51} 27.Ne7+ {6:42} Kh8 {7:49} 28.Bb4 {6:25} Rg8 {7:29} {OverseasTeacher21 wins by Resignation}

DerekDHarvey

I can't see.

Jonzudama
I would not, but I always had difficulty using knights properly… so