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Chess Engine
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Dec 29, 2009
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#23
apsyrtes wrote:
Czech_M8 wrote:
The freeware version (Rebel Decade) is ~2300 ELO...the strength of the fully enabled Rebel is ~2500 ELO - either of which would be more than enough for the majority of players here. Anyoneelse ever used either engine?
The latest incarnation of Rebel is named Pro Deo and it is now fully freeware. I enjoy playing against it.
ProDeo is #16 on the list I pasted
Dec 29, 2009
0
#24
TheKinGpiN wrote:
i just found out that robbolito is free and 3300 elo and better than rybka. even beat deep rybka 3 in a tactics test and only using one cpu! its extremely fast, im using it now. and in an engine match between stockfish multi cpu it won 4 games in a row and CREAMED it. it only took like 2 seconds to move and stockfish was taking forever and still got creamed in 3 minute timeframe. robbolito is crazy
Cite sources please. I don't find anything about robbolito on the usual UCI forums, such as the one from whichj I pasted the Top 40 list.
robbolito is a rybka 3 clone, this is fairly common knowledge, so i wouldn't bother with it myself. as for the best free engines, going by the tourneys i run on my pc id say they are probably stockfish 1.6, the old rybka 2.2n2, toga 11, and there are some good ones on the arena gui. but commercially rybka 3 is way ahead of all the rest still and regularly blows ever other engine i have away. as for those who say 2500 elo is enough...pfft, try using a 2500 elo engine to analyse corres' chess games and see how many beatings you take (and before you harp on about 'cheating', engine use is permitted on iccf, the official fide endorsed corres' chess site). and if you are only using an engine for analysis why would a 2500 engine be of any use compared to a 3100 engine. one will give you accurate in depth analysis, the other one will be OK-ish. i know what id prefer.
Here are some more rating lists to help you make a decision:
http://computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/404/
http://www.husvankempen.de/nunn/40_4_Ratinglist/40_4_BestVersion/rangliste.html
However, keep in mind that interesting style gets no extra points. Junior and Thinker among others have very unique, aggressive and entertainng styles.
Dec 29, 2009
0
#27
joeysouth21 wrote:
You know, the chess.com analyzer is just perfect for what you need. Of course, if you want to cheat in your games like many other pathetic noobs on here, the more experienced players will know and you will get kicked off after being reported. In which case, you are right, you dont want to spend money on it.
Agreed, chess.com provides plenty of material. If used to cheat you will get caught and good riddance to any who do
analysing your chess is not cheating. i doubt there is one GM who doesnt use an engine. so, if you want to remain in the dark ages and have such a naive attitude towards the best analysing partner you will ever have...feel free
speak for yourself...it isnt perfect for what i need...far from. some of us need an engine that is capable of matching rybka, not some crumby 2500 thing, as we know our oppnts are using it, and no, it isnt cheating. go to the iccf website to see for yourself. and that isnt some meaningless chess site, it is an official fide endorsed site. if we can all use them it offers no advantage does it. the point of an engine is also to improve your own game. how many of us have a super GM lying around we can analyse with??
djbl wrote:
analysing your chess is not cheating. i doubt there is one GM who doesnt use an engine. so, if you want to remain in the dark ages and have such a naive attitude towards the best analysing partner you will ever have...feel free
I agree that engines are useful and that the chess.com analysis is inferior to using Rybka on good hardware for a reasonable amount of time. However, keep in mind that it is indeed cheating if used during the game.
Dec 29, 2009
0
#31
Ziryab wrote:
TheKinGpiN wrote:
i just found out that robbolito is free and 3300 elo and better than rybka. even beat deep rybka 3 in a tactics test and only using one cpu! its extremely fast, im using it now. and in an engine match between stockfish multi cpu it won 4 games in a row and CREAMED it. it only took like 2 seconds to move and stockfish was taking forever and still got creamed in 3 minute timeframe. robbolito is crazy
Cite sources please. I don't find anything about robbolito on the usual UCI forums, such as the one from whichj I pasted the Top 40 list.
That's because it's highly suspected to be a Rybka clone and principled computer chess sites & fora refrain from promoting the engine until everything becomes clear.
Dec 29, 2009
0
#32
Stockfish 1.6 seems to be doing quite well in a little engine tournament I'm running that includes Hiarcs 12 (bought), Fritz 9 (bought), Rybka 2.2 (free), Naum 2.0 (free), and Crafty 23.0 (free). The event is running within the Fritz 11 GUI (bought with H12). Hiarcs, Rybka, and Fritz are using their own opening books. The other three are using one I created.
Stockfish has yet to play Hiarcs and Rybka, which drew in their individual game. Crafty drew Hiarcs, but lost to Stockfish. Naum drew Rybka, but lost to Stockfish.
djbl wrote:
robbolito is a rybka 3 clone, this is fairly common knowledge, so i wouldn't bother with it myself. '
While there is still debate as to whether Robbolito is a clone of Rybka or not, there are numerous articles online detailing the differences between the two engines. Rybka is a closed source program while Robbolito is open source. Rybka 3 is estimated at ~3200 or so, Robbolito ~3300.
djbl wrote:
as for those who say 2500 elo is enough...pfft, try using a 2500 elo engine to analyse corres' chess games and see how many beatings you take (and before you harp on about 'cheating', engine use is permitted on iccf, the official fide endorsed corres' chess site).
Would that be the International Computer Chess Federation?? Because if you're talking about the International Correspondence Chess Federation, I couldn't seem to find anything in the rules permitting or advocating engine use during gameplay. Contrary to that, there does seem to be a lot of discussion in their forums that admonishes inappropriate use of engines. Proper use of engines would be for study or analysis after the fact, not for help in defeating an opponent. That would be considered cheating here and could get you booted.
You vs a human opponent, an engine around 2500 ELO is probably more than sufficient, unless you're a Master or something. The only reason you'd need an engine over 3000 ELO would be to compete with others who are using them. Myself I don't see the point of pitting engine against engine. The best and most fun chess is played between two human competitors using their own knowledge & abilities.
davejitsu wrote:
joeysouth21 wrote:
You know, the chess.com analyzer is just perfect for what you need. Of course, if you want to cheat in your games like many other pathetic noobs on here, the more experienced players will know and you will get kicked off after being reported. In which case, you are right, you dont want to spend money on it.
Agreed, chess.com provides plenty of material. If used to cheat you will get caught and good riddance to any who do
Guys have you seen previous post? I said I'm going to use it for studying my previous games. I'm aware that using chess engine or other chess software to cheat on my games will be resulting on banning my account here.
exigentsky wrote:
djbl wrote:
analysing your chess is not cheating. i doubt there is one GM who doesnt use an engine. so, if you want to remain in the dark ages and have such a naive attitude towards the best analysing partner you will ever have...feel free
I agree that engines are useful and that the chess.com analysis is inferior to using Rybka on good hardware for a reasonable amount of time. However, keep in mind that it is indeed cheating if used during the game.
Analysing is not cheating as long you used appropriately. Like what I said earlier I'm aware that cheating on your games will resulting on losing your account here in chess.com.
Guys I know you just want to remind me 'the consequences of cheating in your games' and I would like to say thank you for that. But please guys I don't want anyone to remind me again because I feel I'm insulted and treated like stupid as you think I'm not aware of that. Guys I'm not stupid to cheat on my games.
Czech_M8 wrote:
djbl wrote:
as for those who say 2500 elo is enough...pfft, try using a 2500 elo engine to analyse corres' chess games and see how many beatings you take (and before you harp on about 'cheating', engine use is permitted on iccf, the official fide endorsed corres' chess site).
Would that be the International Computer Chess Federation?? Because if you're talking about the International Correspondence Chess Federation, I couldn't seem to find anything in the rules permitting or advocating engine use during gameplay. Contrary to that, there does seem to be a lot of discussion in their forums that admonishes inappropriate use of engines. Proper use of engines would be for study or analysis after the fact, not for help in defeating an opponent. That would be considered cheating here and could get you booted.
You vs a human opponent, an engine around 2500 ELO is probably more than sufficient, unless you're a Master or something. The only reason you'd need an engine over 3000 ELO would be to compete with others who are using them. Myself I don't see the point of pitting engine against engine. The best and most fun chess is played between two human competitors using their own knowledge & abilities.
A 2500 ELO chess engine like Fritz 4 is still fairly weak in absolute terms. It's especially poor in positional chess and will sometimes make moves that are clearly bad even to a Class A player. Engines are strong for different reasons than humans and they are definitely lacking in some areas. 2500 ELO is far from perfect chess and thus, a lot is gained from stronger engines.
Since you get more accurate analysis, you are less likely to learn the wrong lessons. You'll also learn some lessons that other engines won't teach you. For example, Rybka 3 plays excellent positional chess once it enters the middlegame. It isn't just for evaluating tactics. Moreover, a stronger engine will find the best moves much faster.
If you don't see the difference between an engine rated 2500 ELO and one rated 3200 ELO, you must also not appreciate the difference between a player like myself and a GM. Such an ELO gap is enormous and shows a vast difference in playing strength.
Dec 30, 2009
0
#39
Ziryab wrote:
1 Rybka 3-x64-2cpu 3090 69 64 104 81% 2837 24%
2 Naum 4.0-2cpu-x64 3039 63 60 104 76% 2841 33%
3 Thinker 5.4j-x64-2cpu 2994 81 77 52 65% 2889 38%
4 Fruit 2.6d-x64-2cpu 2988 81 78 52 64% 2889 37%
5 Zappa Mexico II-x64-2cpu 2970 60 57 104 70% 2826 36%
6 Hiarcs 12.1-2cpu 2949 59 57 104 64% 2848 36%
7 Glaurung 2.2-x64-2cpu 2904 57 56 104 59% 2851 40%
8 Bright 0.4a-2cpu 2897 57 56 104 56% 2852 40%
9 Spike 1.3x6-2cpu 2872 78 79 52 46% 2898 38%
10 Jonny 3.07b-2cpu 2852 58 58 104 50% 2855 30%
11 Ktulu 9.0 2851 56 56 104 52% 2835 37%
12 Crafty 23.0-x64-2cpu 2779 75 72 52 65% 2690 54%
13 ChessTiger 2007.1 2764 42 42 196 53% 2741 40%
14 TwistedLogic 20090105-x64 2757 99 89 44 77% 2560 27%
15 Movei 0.08.438 2722 42 42 196 57% 2676 30%
16 Pro Deo 1.6 2718 56 58 104 33% 2845 38%
17 Gandalf 6.01 2716 21 21 748 54% 2690 35%
18 Chiron 0.87 2710 37 37 252 55% 2674 27%
19 Equilibrium 2.6.17 2708 56 57 104 44% 2759 34%
20 Delfi 5.4-2cpu 2706 56 56 104 44% 2759 36%
21 WildCat 8.0 2701 50 51 132 45% 2739 31%
22 Scorpio 2.1-x64-2CPU 2699 77 77 52 50% 2696 38%
23 Booot 4.15.0 2687 63 61 88 64% 2590 33%
24 Pharaon 3.5.1-2cpu 2687 49 49 132 44% 2740 39%
25 Alaric 707 2676 42 41 208 67% 2554 27%
26 Colossus 2008b 2676 55 56 104 40% 2741 40%
27 Ruffian 2.1.0 2670 19 19 952 50% 2670 36%
28 SlowChess blitz WV2.1 2667 28 29 408 40% 2736 36%
29 Frenzee Feb08-x64 2661 54 54 116 58% 2611 28%
30 The Baron 3.8-x64-2cpu 2658 88 100 52 17% 2914 23%
31 Cyrano 0.6b17-x64 2658 55 54 116 66% 2551 33%
32 Aristarch 4.50 2657 20 20 856 49% 2665 33%
33 Maestro 3.0 2655 50 51 132 40% 2729 34%
34 E.T.Chess 130108 2649 66 63 88 64% 2548 22%
35 Alfil 8.11 2645 50 48 188 74% 2440 20%
36 Hamsters 0.7.1 2643 63 61 88 59% 2580 28%
37 Petir 5.0 2632 40 40 208 53% 2606 31%
38 Arasan 11.4-x64 2629 87 85 44 58% 2572 34%
39 BugChess2 1.6.3-x64 2623 56 55 116 60% 2543 24%
40 Pseudo 0.7c 2613 23 23 668 53% 2589 31%
http://wbec-ridderkerk.nl/html/BayesianElo_ed16.htm
Top 40:
Rank Name Elo + - games score oppo. draws1 Rybka 3-x64-2cpu 3090 69 64 104 81% 2837 24%
2 Naum 4.0-2cpu-x64 3039 63 60 104 76% 2841 33%
3 Thinker 5.4j-x64-2cpu 2994 81 77 52 65% 2889 38%
4 Fruit 2.6d-x64-2cpu 2988 81 78 52 64% 2889 37%
5 Zappa Mexico II-x64-2cpu 2970 60 57 104 70% 2826 36%
6 Hiarcs 12.1-2cpu 2949 59 57 104 64% 2848 36%
7 Glaurung 2.2-x64-2cpu 2904 57 56 104 59% 2851 40%
8 Bright 0.4a-2cpu 2897 57 56 104 56% 2852 40%
9 Spike 1.3x6-2cpu 2872 78 79 52 46% 2898 38%
10 Jonny 3.07b-2cpu 2852 58 58 104 50% 2855 30%
11 Ktulu 9.0 2851 56 56 104 52% 2835 37%
12 Crafty 23.0-x64-2cpu 2779 75 72 52 65% 2690 54%
13 ChessTiger 2007.1 2764 42 42 196 53% 2741 40%
14 TwistedLogic 20090105-x64 2757 99 89 44 77% 2560 27%
15 Movei 0.08.438 2722 42 42 196 57% 2676 30%
16 Pro Deo 1.6 2718 56 58 104 33% 2845 38%
17 Gandalf 6.01 2716 21 21 748 54% 2690 35%
18 Chiron 0.87 2710 37 37 252 55% 2674 27%
19 Equilibrium 2.6.17 2708 56 57 104 44% 2759 34%
20 Delfi 5.4-2cpu 2706 56 56 104 44% 2759 36%
21 WildCat 8.0 2701 50 51 132 45% 2739 31%
22 Scorpio 2.1-x64-2CPU 2699 77 77 52 50% 2696 38%
23 Booot 4.15.0 2687 63 61 88 64% 2590 33%
24 Pharaon 3.5.1-2cpu 2687 49 49 132 44% 2740 39%
25 Alaric 707 2676 42 41 208 67% 2554 27%
26 Colossus 2008b 2676 55 56 104 40% 2741 40%
27 Ruffian 2.1.0 2670 19 19 952 50% 2670 36%
28 SlowChess blitz WV2.1 2667 28 29 408 40% 2736 36%
29 Frenzee Feb08-x64 2661 54 54 116 58% 2611 28%
30 The Baron 3.8-x64-2cpu 2658 88 100 52 17% 2914 23%
31 Cyrano 0.6b17-x64 2658 55 54 116 66% 2551 33%
32 Aristarch 4.50 2657 20 20 856 49% 2665 33%
33 Maestro 3.0 2655 50 51 132 40% 2729 34%
34 E.T.Chess 130108 2649 66 63 88 64% 2548 22%
35 Alfil 8.11 2645 50 48 188 74% 2440 20%
36 Hamsters 0.7.1 2643 63 61 88 59% 2580 28%
37 Petir 5.0 2632 40 40 208 53% 2606 31%
38 Arasan 11.4-x64 2629 87 85 44 58% 2572 34%
39 BugChess2 1.6.3-x64 2623 56 55 116 60% 2543 24%
40 Pseudo 0.7c 2613 23 23 668 53% 2589 31%
http://wbec-ridderkerk.nl/html/BayesianElo_ed16.htm
SURELY Shredder should be in the top 5 there... no?
Dec 30, 2009
0
#40
exigentsky wrote:
Rybka is clearly the best at the moment. However, if you're interested in a chess engine and GUI that runs on Linux, Windows and OS X, Deep Shredder 12 isn't far behind.
OH yea. I'm running Shredder 12 under the Ubuntu platform, and it is REALLY smooth. Very good deal, if you ask me.
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/2330314/shredder_12_for_linuxbased_systems.html?cat=15
There is a product review I wrote on it - NOTHING but good things to say. :)
i just found out that robbolito is free and 3300 elo and better than rybka. even beat deep rybka 3 in a tactics test and only using one cpu! its extremely fast, im using it now. and in an engine match between stockfish multi cpu it won 4 games in a row and CREAMED it. it only took like 2 seconds to move and stockfish was taking forever and still got creamed in 3 minute timeframe. robbolito is crazy