Does white have more of an advantage than black?

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SonOfThunder2

White is always 1 move ahead.  And he gets extra clock time for first move.

Vease
X_PLAYER_J_X wrote:
Vease wrote:

Carlsen plays lines that his opponent will not have looked at, that is as far as his 'preparation' extends. He played the Ponziani against Harikrishna in Wijk 2013 for goodness sake, nobody prepares anything against that.

You miss the point.

The point I was making was Magnus Carlsen has some of the best opening study/preparation in the world.

Harikrishna would not be able to prepare against Magnus in the Ponziani because he wouldn't know Magnus is even playing it against him!

The "person" who is doing the preparation is "Magnus".

The Ponziani opening is not considered one of the greatest chess lines.

Which means Magnus would have to do extreme preparation when playing it.

 

We will just have to agree to disagree, Carlsen doesn't get involved in any theoretical battles in main line openings because he doesn't want to be surprised by a novelty from his opponent. Throwing out the Ponziani is a good choice in this case because there haven't been any critical novelties in that opening for a hundred years! They followed a game from 1965 up to move 8 but I would doubt if either of them actually knew that at the time. The same goes for his quiet double fianchetto openings with White, there aren't any variations where Black can blow the position open and play for an advantage, its all about manouevring and keeping control of the position with the view to squeezing out a small plus in the endgame.

Paradox_King

I think there is an advantage because...

  • White has most say in what the opening will be
  • White is a tempo up
  • White can control center more easily in opening
  • White can choose if he wants to be defensive or offensive more easily than black
Priteshrp87

We Indians don't see if we have white pieces or black. We just play...infact, I love to play with black pieces!

Squarely
...half a tempo at most. White has the disadvantage of having to reveal his plan of attack first. I love playing black.
DoctorStrange
Priteshrp87 wrote:

We Indians don't see if we have white pieces or black. We just play...infact, I love to play with black pieces!

You may do that but some don't. White pieces matter. White has a slight edge from the opening to ending.

Shakaali

First move advantage is very real. At the top level white scores approximately 55% which is the expected score for someone 35 Elo points stronger. In other words, changing colours of the players also changes the balance of power by about 70 Elo.

In a game between complete beginners first move advantage is naturally almost meaningless but with increased skill it quickly becomes important. One might think that the advantage would continue to increase the further up you go along the Elo ladder but I'm not sure if that's true. I tried doing some database searches and while I don't have very extensive database for U2000 games I compared games where both players are rated 2600+ with those where they lie in 2100-2300 range and couldn't see any big difference in stats.

Squarely

E

dashdo101

what do u mean by "E = Trump"

BlargDragon

The advantage varies according to the acceleration of the frame of reference. This is why some players play better or worse relative to the set of all players when given different time controls.

SonOfThunder2

A

SonOfThunder2

Maybe E

DoctorStrange

B

TheBlunderfulPlayer

A, but the advantage is very small. This advantage can't be converted to a forced win, however, as it is a very small one.

Squarely

...only in reality.

DO_TEA

It's simple.

 

Playing white inflates your elo by 70.

Playing black deflates your elo by 70.

Bilbo21

I would have thought the inflation/deflation would increase with rating.

solskytz

I read someplace that white scores 55% and black 45%. If this is true, consider the following:

two 2000-rated players who alternate white and black are supposed to score 50% against each other. 

Two 2000-rated players where one always plays white, are supposed to score 55% - 45%. 

This type of score corresponds to a rating difference of about 35 points, if memory serves. 

This means that the first player had his rating boosted by 17.5, and the second had his rating depressed by 17.5 - so 2017.5 - 1982.5. 

White gives you an extra 17.5 elo. Black takes away 17.5 elo from you. 

SilentKnighte5

The +35-40 elo advantage is true for GM practice.  The advantage decreases with skill.

solskytz

 

This seems to be true.

I now look at my own blitz stats - and over 10,824 blitz games played (Oh my!! 10,824 already?? I should get a life!!), I win one percent more games as white (50% compared to 48.8%) and I draw one percent more as black (6.9% compared to 5.9%). My loss percentage is pretty much the same (44.1% compared to 44.3%). 

This means that I score 0.5% better as white overall. Who would believe!