Game Analysis is Wrong

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mcusername

This is probably not news to anybody, but I'm finding that the game analysis is often just plain wrong.  If I see a way to checkmate my opponent in three moves by a rook sacrifice, the analysis will tell me that the rook sacrifice is a mistake and tell me I should have captured a piece on the other side of the board.  

Martin_Stahl
mcusername wrote:

This is probably not news to anybody, but I'm finding that the game analysis is often just plain wrong. If I see a way to checkmate my opponent in three moves by a rook sacrifice, the analysis will tell me that the rook sacrifice is a mistake and tell me I should have captured a piece on the other side of the board.

It's probably not wrong, you're just missing something in the position. Can you provide and example game link and the move you where you think it was wrong?

mcusername

I'm pretty sure it was wrong. It's done that before. It will tell me a move is a blunder -- then it will give me an exceptional score when I execute the denouement of my three-move plan. The analysis does not take into account what I subsequently do.

mcusername

mcusername

Please see screenshot. It's telling me the rook move is a mistake. However, it leads to check in a few moves.

mcusername

Chess.com defines a mistake as a move that immediately worsens your position. The rook sacrifice is not such a move.

nklristic

The analysis is correct. It is equal after rook sacrifice. 27. ...Rf7 instead of Kh8 and there is no checkmate.

Don't take the next part too seriously, but here is the possible idea.
The engine wants you to possibly make that sacrifice down the line, but wants you to play Na4 first, with a possible idea to then sacrifice and after he plays Bg7 and Rf7, for you to play Nc5 and maybe maneuver that knight to target g7 bishop as well. Of course game could go the other way as well... But anyway white is then better. Here simple Rf7 and there is no immediate knockout.

PromisingPawns

Haha...stockfish is never wrong if it can show a sample line

magipi

The bizarre thing is the mcusername is 1600 in puzzles, so it is absurd that he couldn't find the obvious Rf7 defense.

It is even more absurd how bad and unhelpful the Game review feature is. It is almost impossible to use it to find anything, the only way is to switch to the Analysis tab.

nklristic
magipi wrote:

The bizarre thing is the mcusername is 1600 in puzzles, so it is absurd that he couldn't find the obvious Rf7 defense.

It is even more absurd how bad and unhelpful the Game review feature is. It is almost impossible to use it to find anything, the only way is to switch to the Analysis tab.

Yup, review is for fun to see accuracy and estimated rating, switching to analysis is what should be done and the answers are there.

As for Rf7, sometimes it is difficult to see what is hiding in plain sight. For instance sometimes I look at a puzzle for a minute looking for something a bit complex, as something catches my eye, and only after a while I see that the queen is hanging.

mcusername

The worst that could be said about my rook move is that it might not be the best possible move, but that does not make it a mistake. That said, I personally cannot see a better move. As I recall, the analysis-bot wanted me to threaten the black rook with knight to A4, but I don't know what that move has to do with the price of tea in China. It is on the other side of the board from black's king, and I don't see how it helps me achieve checkmate, let alone a faster checkmate than what could be accomplished with the move that I actually did make.

mcusername

I'm not sure I understand. I was playing white. What do you mean when I could not find a defense?

nklristic

The way the report is working, it works with numbers and depending on how much the estimation changes it says if it is a good move, an innacuracy , mistake or blunder. Sometimes even when you lose a queen it is only shown as a mistake , because for instance you were already lost. 
That being said, the estimation was a bit below +2, and after your move, it was +0.00, so that is why it presents your move as a mistake.

nklristic
mcusername wrote:

I'm not sure I understand. I was playing white. What do you mean when I could not find a defense?

He means : you thought it was a checkmate, and didn't see that Rf7 move from your opponent doesn't allow checkmate, AKA you missed that defence by black.

mcusername

Yes, but that is still not right by chess.com's own definition. It says a mistake immediately places you in a bad position. That is not the case.

mcusername

Okay. I think I'm getting it -- a little. My move was not a mistake -- but mainly because black played a poor response to it?

nklristic
mcusername wrote:

Yes, but that is still not right by chess.com's own definition. It says a mistake immediately places you in a bad position. That is not the case.

Well, here you are not worse, but you were practically winning or at least you were much better, and after your move you were equal, so it is clearly not a good move.
If that is the official definition for mistake by chess. com, they should change it a bit.

mcusername

Thanks for the input. I see now that the move was not as good as I thought it was. It looked like a great move to me -- but only because black responded poorly to it!

nklristic
mcusername wrote:

Okay. I think I'm getting it -- a little. My move was not a mistake -- but mainly because black played a poor response to it?

Basically he allowed your move to work by not playing Rf7, and made your move the best on the board. happy.png

You're welcome.

mcusername

Got it, nklristic, thanks again!