Geller and Tal had positive records against Fischer. Why? Explain.

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TheGreatOogieBoogie

Fischer liked to play for a win at all costs, even in situations when it wasn't appropriate.  Fischer gave away a drawn position against Spassky in a book draw.  

Nckchrls
The_Ghostess_Lola wrote:

NckChris, there are alotta ppl who have grown to despise me. All I'm trying to do is objectively analyse BF....and I get called a hater and a troll and cyberspit on.

It's not fair at all. And I'm dis<3'nd by it all. And especially disappointed in some of the Baby Boomers and their radical myopic defence of BF.

Your input is refreshing....TY NckChris.

Don't get too down. The Bobby Fischer Myth is huge and I'm saying this as a big, big Fischer fan. I learned about chess watching the 72 WC on TV and I was so taken by the games my parents bought me Fischer's My60MG and I carried it around to all the top tourneys I could go to for the next few years.

Unfortunately I never got to meet the guy but in talking to players who played him and knew him, it didn't take long to figure out Fischer away from the board had plenty of issues.

So maybe it comes down to 80% of the Fischer myth on the chessboard is probably defendable and 80% of the  positive Fischer myth away from the board is probably just legend. As usual, it seems to always end up with shades of grey.

JamieDelarosa

The game had not yet started.

The picture is often misidentified as Fischer vs Petrosian, 1971 Candidates final.  However, that is incorect, as the boards and players in the background demonstrate.

Instead, I believe it to be from the "USSR vs The Rest of the World" match, played in Belgrade, Yugoslavia, 1970.

Petrosian was not smiling at the end of the four game match, as Bobby clobbered him 3-1 (2 wins, 2 draws).  Fischer was returning to chess after a two-year layoff.

TheOldReb

Fischer soon wiped that smirk from Petrosian's face and then stomped him in their 71 match in Argentina . 

Like this : 

patzermike

Here's a radical theory. If GMs play thousands of games with dozens of GMs, by chance mismatches will occur. According to chessgames.com, Polugaevsky's record against Tal was 8-2 aand 22 draws. If you look at the years you will see that it was not a matter of Polugevsky beating a young undeveloped Tal.Polygaevsky was a strong respected GM. But surely Tal was generally a much stronger player.

The_Ghostess_Lola

Any of the Boris's could beat him. Boris Spassky, Boris Gelfand, Boris Gulko, Boris Yeltsin, Boris Karloff....all of them.

TheGreatOogieBoogie

I agree that Gelfand could beat him but not Spassky.  I don't know enough about Yeltsin or Karloff to make a judgment call there.  

RamshackleOfFresno

Ha ha! Boris Yeltsin! Wink And Karloff! Foot in MouthLaughing Lola, you are hilarious! And OogieBoogie, you are perhaps more funny than you know! Lola, you must be a little older than Boogie. ;)  Tears in my eyes!

JeanMichelJamJar
GreedyPawnEater wrote:

Nice point there. Boris Gelfand is many many times stronger than Boris Spassky and twice as many times than Bobby Fischer.

TheOldReb
chessmicky wrote:

Starting from 1962, when Fischer was 19 until the end of his career, Booby faced the cream of the Soviet chess world around 117 times. His record against Tal, Geller, Smyslov, Petrosian, Stein, Taimanov, Korchnoi, and Spassky was a mere 72.5 - 44.5. I think we can stamp this particular discussion "CASE CLOSED"

Interesting , did you include games with Botvinnik and Keres ? 

The_Ghostess_Lola

Well said GPE !

Okay. Let me make it perfectly clear that in 1972 when BF was 29 years old and in his prime ?....Botvinnik was age 61, Bronstein was 48, Stein was 38, Smyslov was 51, Keres was 56, and Taimanov was 46.

He could not beat these players in their prime until he reached his prime and after they had exited theirs ?

Pleez, take into consideration a player's age in chess. I mean, fair is fair.

JeanMichelJamJar

Bobby was too busy looking good to waste much time playing those lazy Soviets.

The_Ghostess_Lola

Marcos, if you really look like that ?....I promise you I will be in Nassau tonite....Smile....

JeanMichelJamJar

heres Bobby winning the mens doubles at wimbledon.

its amazing he found any time to study chess at all!

TheOldReb

Isnt that Bobby and Jimbo ? 

JeanMichelJamJar

its a basketball player, Reb! Bobby had to serve ace after ace to win that title with a non-pro! he was a genius.

its my passport pic, Lola! had to suppress my natural smile :-)

JamieDelarosa
Reb wrote:

Isnt that Bobby and Jimbo ? 

A reverse image search suggests it is Fischer serving in a celebrity tennis match, with playing partner Gail Goodrich (professional basketball player)

JeanMichelJamJar

Fischer taught himself Russian!

"taught himself".

the Russians had their skills downloaded, would have been much quicker for them if it could have been stored by electric current.

JamieDelarosa
GreedyPawnEater wrote:

Fischer played Botvinnik only once because Botvinnik had more important things to do than being champion for 40 years. When Fischer appeared Botvinnik was working on his academic career. He had no interest in beating Fischer.

Botvinnik Fide titlist:

1948 (fixed tournament) - 1957 (Lost to Smslov)

1958 (Smyslov throws rematch on orders) - 1960 (Lost to Tal)

1961 (Deathly ill Tal force to play rematch, loses) -1963 (Lost to Petrosian)

Botninnik held the FIDE title for 13 years, and never managed to win a title match as champion, such was the Soviet chicanery.

JeanMichelJamJar

such a cute guy, if he would just come back to earth once in a while he might know whats going on down here.