High standard rating + low blitz/bullet rating indicative of engine use in live chess?

I consistently play in the 1850+ standard crowd on live chess here, and have noticed that there seems to be an abundance of 1900+ players with low, (often below 1200) blitz ratings who seem to play flawlessly in any type of tactical situation. In fact, it is much more common for me to lose against such a player (high standard, low blitz) than against someone with a high standard and higher blitz rating (e.g. 1950 standard, 2150 blitz).

 

Furthermore, these players are often weak in other things too, such as tactics puzzles, and their standard ratings are way out of proportion with the rest of their stats. I have played here for years and my blitz rating has always been a good 100+ points above my standard, often 200 above, and I play with a crappy laptop touch pad mouse which causes me to lose a lot of time scrambles to boot... In other words, on chess.com live chess it seems as though one's blitz rating should be higher than his or her standard rating, and I am sure most of you would agree that an 1800 standard player is generally far stronger than an 1800 blitz player.

 

So, provisional ratings aside, how can someone be 1900+ standard and 1100 in blitz, 1500 in tactics trainer, etc??? It just doesn't add up. Would you agree that this kind of rating disparity is indicative of computer use (the obvious point being that in blitz/bullet there is not enough time to use an engine), or are there really just a ton of players who are really strong in standard and weak at everything else?? Not to mention the suspicious looking moves, perfect tactics, roughly equal amount of time taken between most of their moves, and long delays between simple recaptures, etc., which I often see from my opponents.

 

Sorry if anything in this post is offensive in any way. I just feel like despite the efforts of chess.com to catch and ban cheaters, the whole cheating scene is out of control. I just browsed through my archive of games from April 21st until now, less than a month, and there were 5 different players who had their accounts banned for unfair play sometime after playing me, all in 15/10 time control (none in blitz). Who knows how many still haven't been caught? It is just frustrating for those of us who want to use chess.com live as a training ground to help us improve in OTB and tournament play. I don't even understand why people cheat anyways....

 

Interested in hearing your opinions on this.

It's normal to have a much higher rating in standard than blitz. More time = finding better moves.

Actually on this site in particular I find it to be the opposite (at least among legit players): standard is almost always equal to or lower than blitz (well, I am not sure about at lower levels, but at my level it seems to be that way). It is not to say that a given player is better at one or the other, but rather, that blitz ratings are just higher within the rating pool relative to the level (e.g. an 1800 standard and 2000 blitz might be of roughly the same strength).

 

Hope that makes sense...

If you see someone with a somewhat established blitz (3 minute)/bullet rating much much lower than their standard, it's almost certain they're cheating. 10 minute, or 3+2 "blitz" gives enough time to use an engine. Even 5 minute, although a classic time control, is vulnerable. I see cheaters getting timed out in 3 minute all the time though. In my entire career in chess, which is not that much, but I've seen a lot of different players still, I've never seen a single (legitimate) player with that much disparity between speed and standard - 1300 blitz/bullet vs. 2000 rapid, etc. BTW, daily ratings are very inflated up until around 1900s+, where it starts to compress a lot more. 1700 daily with 1100-1300 speed chess is a little low for the speed chess, but in the normal range.

I'd recommend Daily, as most cheaters are caught midgame - at least that's my experience.

BTW, the fact that Computer-Impossible, in rapid, although able to defeat IMs and NMs like "John" and "Jerry" (the youtubers), yet the last time I saw it, it was only like 2100 in rapid (because it's forced to play anyone) shows how bad the rapid pool is.

Most players I play in rapid time controls have a blizt rating of 1100-1200 or 1600-1700. Usually rapid ratings are higher than blizt ratings.

 

This is exactly what I am talking about. How can a 2000 standard player, playing more or less flawlessly in tactical situations, be 1300 or lower in blitz? 1300s on here hang all kinds of pieces and as a 2100ish blitz player on here I should be able to crush them with hardly any trouble at all, yet add 10 more minutes to the clock and I am the one getting crushed? It is so inconsistent.

 

I didn't even bring up daily chess in my original post, which has its own cheaters of course but also many strong and honest players.

 

I am quite discouraged by playing chess online these days as it seems like I either have to choose between a long game with a good chance of facing a cheater, or blitz, where it becomes mostly about winning on time and is hard to improve one's game. OTB is really the way to go, but I don't have frequent enough access to it to fulfill my chess cravings....

Unless you're a paid member and have unlimited tactics, it's hard to improve your tactics rating over a short period of time since you only have 5 per day. Also, you should check if they do play blitz or bullet games regularly. For me my rapid rating here is around 1800 and my blitz/bullet are around 2300. I simply just don't play rapid games. Also, some people tend to be better at long games rather than short games.

I couldn't imagine trying to play faster chess using a laptop's touchpad. I bet lots of people that are used to it do it though. I grew up using a mouse and absolutely hate it when I don't have one with me and have to use the touchpad. I don't mind using a phone though. Sorry, a bit off topic, that part of the original post caught my eye.

Some people simply can't play blitz. That is how it works

I'm 60 this year. I've found that as I've aged my OTB rating has improved but my Lightning (5 minute) rating has fallen. The gap is now about 300 points.

at 2000 level I estimate at least 25% are suspect in 15 10 games. Looking back through my history many of my opponents now banned, some I reprted myself.

    I roll my eyes when I see opponent 2000 at rapid and only 1000 at bullet, and all the variants.  99% of the time it means only one thing.

   All my ratings over 2000 except rapid as keep being beaten back by perfect opposition

 

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I think there are many factors that contribute here. I mean not many people even play alot of blitz or bullet or rapid but they play daily chess... one move a day sort of idea makes little commitment for them. Even my Daily is higher than my blitz in general, but I have a good average. As for tactics... if your a non paying member it will take you for ever to get up to 2000 if your a 2000 in everything else because you only get 5 tries a day. I think its very dodgy to judge people by their rating. Besides... think of it this way. If he is using an engine he will probably be alot higher and even if he is using one against you, what does he get from it? You lose and you can learn from the game. He wins and learned nothing. So just chill and play the games... if he is a user, he will get whats coming to him sooner or later. Have fun and join my club for great free video chess lessons content etc.

 

https://www.chess.com/club/the-next-move

Good Luck and have fun

 

The Loner Druid

I think these guys are talking about drastic differences. I agree that family and work can make you dead tired which can play a big part when it comes to alertness during gameplay. I also think that personality plays a part. For instance some people are quick on their feet thinkers, while others are more of the pondering, deep thinking types. 

Agreed. I think there are way too many factors that could contribute to this. So judging is maybe not such a good idea until its obvious. You can always go through the game after and see what the engine says about their play... If your that desperate.

Could it have something to do with consistent bad connectivity for some people that effects their shorter time controls but has less impact on their standard rating?  

BigTy, for me it is being 71 y.o. and my brain just does not seem to work that rapidly (pun intentional).  In addition, it is only this past year that I began playing chess online (this site my sole game site),and  I suspect my game vision has been greatly reduced.  Have a great day!

I think you got it backwards.  Blitz is the ideal format for engines because they can generate a decent move inside 2-3 seconds on any recent hardware (ok,  plus the 1 second that it takes to enter the opponent's move).  The human, OTOH, can't find good moves without some time.

 

Even on an android phone, with truly low end processor, an engine gives good moves inside 1 second, and you can enter opponent moves < 1 second.  How is a human going to match that?  Especially in those super short blitzs.

 

Check it out (if you've got a tablet/phone), you can enter any move you want and ask stockfish to make the next move, or even rewind the moves and re-do.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.adamtai.analysisboard

 

But here's the important part, why would you even care?  Just play another game and chances are you'll face a human player since using engines are meaningless in this context (chess fun).