Is there a universe of difference between a 600 and an 800 player and can you evaluate?

Sort:
kingplaya4

My play? If anyone wants to bother taking the time, don't bother with my games with opponents below my ranking, I admit I've lost a few of those, but I don't take them too seriously as I find them pretty easy to beat. 600 and above games I try to concentrate as best as I can and when its a 700 or 800 ranked opponent I really try to step it up.

Especially 800 ranked players, I mean it doesn't quite feel like I'm playing Bobby Fischer but it seems like these guys rarely make mistakes and some of them seem to have impenetrable defenses.  Any good links for penetrating a good pawn defense, and any other suggestions? Of course you can find several games where I just left my queen hanging, but in general I think around 600-650 is pretty accurate on this site.

Martin_Stahl
kingplaya4 wrote:

My play? If anyone wants to bother taking the time, don't bother with my games with opponents below my ranking, I admit I've lost a few of those, but I don't take them too seriously as I find them pretty easy to beat. 600 and above games I try to concentrate as best as I can and when its a 700 or 800 ranked opponent I really try to step it up.

Especially 800 ranked players, I mean it doesn't quite feel like I'm playing Bobby Fischer but it seems like these guys rarely make mistakes and some of them seem to have impenetrable defenses.  Any good links for penetrating a good pawn defense, and any other suggestions? Of course you can find several games where I just left my queen hanging, but in general I think around 600-650 is pretty accurate on this site.

 

There really isn't much difference between an 800 and 600. 

kingplaya4

Doesn't sound good for my chess future. To me they seem light years more advanced. 

I can say for sure there's a massive difference with anyone ranked below 500, which is probably quite few but with my low score I get the opportunity to play them. They hang pieces constantly whereas most people above my rank seem to rarely do so, but I may still be missing a lot.

mrsandface

There shouldn't be much difference between the two... I think knowing the rules and playing 5 - 20 long games should be enough to be at least 1000.

Caesar49bc

Sorta of yes. Both 600 and 800 level players blunder a LOT, but statistically, the level 800 will spot a game winning blunder more often.

That's not to say level 1800 doesn't blunder a lot either, but major blunders are more positional in nature or take 2 or 3 moves to resolve. Where as sub 1000 players will do stuff like leave pieces en prise, or allow a mate in-1 or an easy to see mate in 2 that the opponent doesn't see.

I say easy to see, because there are plenty of mate-in-2's that more difficult to spot. That's not even looking at chess compositions. There are tens of thousands of mind bending 2 movers that have been composed since the 1800's.

kingplaya4

Here's a game I just played and my opponent allowed me to win it, but he didn't make it easy https://www.chess.com/analysis/game/live/3976106887?tab=report

Certainly a 1200 or probably even a 1000 rated opponent would have made mince meat of me, but this guy made it extremely difficult for me to mate him whereas that would have been a much easier game for me vs a 600 opponent. And I've played some Russian 800s players who were tougher. 

Basically, I know this is a very modest goal, but for now I'd like to get to 800. I need to be more cautious with my pieces and that should get me to 700, but what tactics should I study to give me another 100 or 200 points? Openings? I know for you geniuses it must seem ridiculous that someone can't be 1000 easily, but for normal people it does take some work. I can see some of the higher ranked players I face have a few quick mate tricks up their sleeves and some traps they have planned a few moves ahead. 

Next to someone who has studies games, read books or just has a good natural ability I'm sure any player 1000 or below must seem completely amature, but I can see a big difference in each 100 point level.

Caesar49bc

Why did you trade a knight for a pawn on move 7?

kingplaya4

I guess I thought I was creating an opening on that side, although I realized at the time I should have made the exchange with his bishop earlier. Here's a much better example of a tough 800s player, I got totally killed here: https://www.chess.com/analysis/game/live/3976922288?tab=report

mrsandface

Is this is troll post? X)

kingplaya4

The computer seems to mostly like our play, but I found this 600s opponent way easier. Naturally he let himself time out when he got into serious trouble. https://www.chess.com/analysis/game/live/3976937714?tab=report

mrsandface

Troll

kingplaya4

Look at my rating mrs. not trolling. I simply cannot beat most 800s players, especially if they are Russian or European. Some of the Americans with that rank seem not too different from 600s players I'll admit, although still much sharper.

Reuben_Sammitch
kingplaya4 wrote:

Here's a game I just played and my opponent allowed me to win it, but he didn't make it easy https://www.chess.com/analysis/game/live/3976106887?tab=report

Certainly a 1200 or probably even a 1000 rated opponent would have made mince meat of me, but this guy made it extremely difficult for me to mate him whereas that would have been a much easier game for me vs a 600 opponent. And I've played some Russian 800s players who were tougher. 

Basically, I know this is a very modest goal, but for now I'd like to get to 800. I need to be more cautious with my pieces and that should get me to 700, but what tactics should I study to give me another 100 or 200 points? Openings? I know for you geniuses it must seem ridiculous that someone can't be 1000 easily, but for normal people it does take some work. I can see some of the higher ranked players I face have a few quick mate tricks up their sleeves and some traps they have planned a few moves ahead. 

Next to someone who has studies games, read books or just has a good natural ability I'm sure any player 1000 or below must seem completely amature, but I can see a big difference in each 100 point level.

One thing you can do to help yourself improve would be to pay attention to the post-game analysis the software gives you after each game. Click on each of your moves that is highlighted in orange or red and see if you can work out why it is a mistake, and why the move suggested by the software is better. Also, read about tactics, and practice them here at chess.com.

In general, the site provides a number of tools to help you improve. Use them.

Reuben_Sammitch
mrsandface wrote:

Troll

I don't think he is trolling. He is rated <700 and that first game he posted was pretty awful.

Bulldogg9098

At this level of play, you should be concerned mainly with two things: naturalizing your understanding of piece movements and figuring out why your opponent made the move they did. Let me explain.

In your game against ddreddzk, when black moved his knight to d4, you need to ask yourself "why?" The goal you need to stretch for is discovering what your opponent is trying to do next. You don't need to search ten moves ahead, just look at the next move. If you can notice that the knight on d4 is attacking your bishop on b5, you will want to respond to it.

Part of the problem, I think, is that you are not quite able to see where your opponent's pieces are going. This can be seen very clearly in the second-to-last move where he puts his knight on f4. He is one move away from delivering checkmate, and you need to be able to spot that kind of thing! What is he attacking with, what is the most dangerous piece in the attack, and can you either: a) take that piece, or b) block that piece with something smaller? 

I'm afraid that you'll get a flood of responses from people who want to recommend tactics and opening theory and stuff, but I think most of that will be a step above where you currently are in learning the game. Keep practicing and you're sure to get better, simply because you'll get to see how your opponent moves his/her pieces and in what order. Try out those strategies against opponents and see how they respond to you!

SpelerThomas

To me it seems that you are missing the mose basic chess principles. In the opening, the idea is to control the center, develop your pieces, castle, and then use pieces to attack the enemy king. In the last game you linked, you moved your bishop twice before any other piece was developed. Also you put it on d3 first. Which is a weird move, because your d pawn can't move to control the center and develop the other bishop. It seems that you lack these basic chess principles. I would advise to start with learning the fundamentals first, and practising it.

kingplaya4

Thanks guys, I know I am terrible, although I do try to think about what their gameplan is when they move a piece and what is coming next. Obviously at times I have no idea. It's tough because with some of the lowest ranked guys I play, there actually is little to no plan.

Speeler or anyone do you have a recommendation on youtube or elsewhere for helping someone on my level get to 1,000? I've been watching some Grandmaster Fineman videos which I think have helped slightly, but mostly the theory is way over my head.

Besides blunders and not knowing the best opening after the first couple of moves, I find that against an aggressive opponent I just play reactively and only win if they happen to seriously blunder.

SpelerThomas

I've watched Finegold's video's a lot. But in my opinion he is more comedian than he is a teacher. I'd advise searching for 'chessnetwork' on youtube and following his beginner to master series at video 1. I just came across these videos only recently, but they've helped me as well. 

kingplaya4

Speler,

Yeah he reminds me of a lot of professors I had in college who I could tell were just "winging it" so to speak without preparing, but they kept their jobs because they were entertaining. I found the series you spoke of, I will soon be one of those deadly 800 level players lol.

Thanks to everyone who was helpful, oh and if there is any good online pdf books I can read (appropriate for someone who knows how the pieces move but has essentially no tactics, please chime in.

daxypoo
i can comment on this because i went through this here on chess.com

a lot of players here have a crap ton of experience, many played for years before ever stepping in here

i started out with 800 here immediately lost several games in a row and really started trying to make something out of this mess at 400 ish

first thing i did was only play daily games for a bit; rapid games were way too fast i felt rushed; starting at daily helped me catch my breath; after a bit i got tired of daily- not having that commitment for an hour to sit down and complete game was getting to me- i needed to jump back in the live action

by this time i had started doing tactics more and had gone through “bobby fisher teaches chess” and learned a out back rank mates- so that was my “plan”- to execute i had to develop and get castled quick to get a rook free and maybe- i might get lucky and get a potential pin against opponents king if he hadnt castled (though i wasnt too familiar with strength of pins quite yet)

i always feared there was some kind of checkmating attack for pretty much any opening and though many said that bringing the queen out early was folly my opponents cavalierly disregarded this advice and stormed across the board with such confidence

from 400-1100 i saw all kinds of variants and subtle attempts at the scholars mate; in fact, my greatest chess achievement was to finally navigate this opening defense successfully and having my moves be the correct sequence of moves to develop and defend and catch opponent behind on development- it was a eureka

so, yes, there is a difference; both players will make glaring catastrophic blunders but the 800 will pick up on it just a bit faster and maybe just have a little bit more experience to consistently eek out a 600; 800’s might have learned how to set up batteries and the 600 will miss the long range potential of rooks but especially bishops; both will make excessive pawn moves especially rook pawns

to get over this hump practice tactics, review your games and be tough on yourself, develop a simple opening response usually 1 e4 or 1d4 for your white games and your defense to 1e4 as (...e5, probably just go for this for now) and 1.d4 (...d5) and really try to apply quick development to traditional squares and checking your position for pieces that need protection

and play 30 minute games
try to use all of your clock