Kings Gambit vs. French Defense

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immortalgamer

gotmilk

3...d4 ugly.

mattattack99

Cool gameLaughing The only thing I disagreed with was when you traded your very good bishop on d3 for black's knight, even if you doubled blacks pawns

immortalgamer
mattattack99 wrote:

Cool game The only thing I disagreed with was when you traded your very good bishop on d3 for black's knight, even if you doubled blacks pawns


Well it was a 2 min game so a lot of times I try to simplify the position and not make things to complicated.  Looking at it though I think it was a perfectly fine move as it gained center control.  I don't think that bishop was overly strong vs. the knight I exchanged for.  Why is it that you think the bishop was very good?

Knightsoul

Thanks for posting this - as a fellow Gambiteer who hasn't played the KG against the French Defense it was a good look into the potential weaknesses and strengths of both player's positions.

TheGreatOogieBoogie

Umm... there is no king's gambit unless black plays 1...e5.  Anyway, it's a sound opening to go off the beaten path, though I will say that it fell out of fashion in the 19th century for a reason.  Although white doesn't lose by force black can resolve his problems much easier in the f4 system than the mainline. 

Knightsoul
ScorpionPackAttack wrote:

Umm... there is no king's gambit unless black plays 1...e5.  Anyway, it's a sound opening to go off the beaten path, though I will say that it fell out of fashion in the 19th century for a reason.  Although white doesn't lose by force black can resolve his problems much easier in the f4 system than the mainline. 

It's a variation of the Kings Gambit unless you want to be really illiberal. The positions that arise and routines carried out are similar enough. And it's still a weakening of White's Kingside whether or not the Bishop Pawn is gambited.

duck_and_cover
Knightsoul wrote:
ScorpionPackAttack wrote:

Umm... there is no king's gambit unless black plays 1...e5.  Anyway, it's a sound opening to go off the beaten path, though I will say that it fell out of fashion in the 19th century for a reason.  Although white doesn't lose by force black can resolve his problems much easier in the f4 system than the mainline. 

It's a variation of the Kings Gambit unless you want to be really illiberal. The positions that arise and routines carried out are similar enough. And it's still a weakening of White's Kingside whether or not the Bishop Pawn is gambited.

lol

tigergutt

the point of 2.f4 in the kings gambit is to undermine the pawn at e5 so it makes not so much sence to play f4 here i think. but its not losing or anything

batgirl

How is that the King's Gambit when there was no gambit involved?

KiwiJuise
batgirl wrote:

How is that the King's Gambit when there was no gambit involved?

Lol, just for emphasis.

tigergutt
Pelikan_Player wrote:

It's more than undermining the e5 pawn, otherwise 2) d4 would accomplish the same thing. Creating a semi-open f file and pressure on f7 are the keys to the opening and, imo, the reason why black can run into trouble so quickly if he/she isn't careful. The bishop on c4 and the knight hop to g5, which can open a line to h5 for the queen, and rook on f1 all exert pressure on f7. The KG is really an attack on black's weakest square in the opening

i see your point but after 1.e4 e6 2.d5 e5 which i think is mainline white cant consider a bishop to c4 and put quick pressure on f7 and the positions look more frenchlike/greek sacrifice thematical to me. i think objectively 2.f4 does undermine the e5pawn and nothing more while 2.d4 does that too and even more, but i looked at some games and the variations look fun. i might try it out myself some day for fun:)

Irontiger

5.Bc4 hits granite on e6. Better Be2 or even Bd3.

6.c3 ? is refuted by the simple ...Bc5 where you can no longer castle.

12...Bc6 ? was a bad move - the knight needs a square !

The "strong" 13...Be4 ? just pushes the queen on g3 (14.Qg3) where Black's g7 pawn is under attack, which does not help Black to develop.

18.d5 ! forces 18...Nb8 or ...Na7 where White's advantage is even greater.

19...f6, though hopeless, was forced.

If 22...Re8, 23.Qh6 ??? loses after 23...Bf8 (but of course 23. cxb4 wins). I hope you saw it.

Avoid using words you don't understand, like "nice positional win".

riv4l
Irontiger wrote:

5.Bc4 hits granite on e6. Better Be2 or even Bd3.

6.c3 ? is refuted by the simple ...Bc5 where you can no longer castle.

12...Bc6 ? was a bad move - the knight needs a square !

The "strong" 13...Be4 ? just pushes the queen on g3 (14.Qg3) where Black's g7 pawn is under attack, which does not help Black to develop.

18.d5 ! forces 18...Nb8 or ...Na7 where White's advantage is even greater.

19...f6, though hopeless, was forced.

If 22...Re8, 23.Qh6 ??? loses after 23...Bf8 (but of course 23. cxb4 wins). I hope you saw it.

Avoid using words you don't understand, like "nice positional win".

even after re8 + bf8, white still has the advantage with the ng5 lending support for qxh7# unless you expect black to play h5 after that configuration. 

Irontiger
Riv4L wrote:
Irontiger wrote:
(...)

If 22...Re8, 23.Qh6 ??? loses after 23...Bf8 (but of course 23. cxb4 wins). I hope you saw it.(...)

even after re8 + bf8, white still has the advantage with the ng5 lending support for qxh7# unless you expect black to play h5 after that configuration. 

What do you mean? At move 22 Black already played ...h7-h5 (and before, he is not forced to miss one-move threats).