The unsolved chessproblem

Who can find the correct FIRST EIGHT MOVES of my unsolved chess problem at youtube.com :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnLiwJ3qe_M

write here at chess.com or at youtube.com

kindly regards from Germany by moremover

Mail : lutz.neweklowsky@gmx.de

Fax : 0049-721-841095

Egads

to ozzie_c_cobblepot :

... here a little help and the first 4 moves :

1.Rxa4 Qxa4

2.Bxa4 Bxa4+

3.Kc5 Rg5+

4.Kb4 Rg4+

... and now the next 4 moves are perhaps easier to solve ...

kindly regards from Germany

... here is now the whole solution of my mate in 551 ( worldrecord for the longest composed mate without obstrusive pieces ) :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnLiwJ3qe_M

1. Rxa4 Qxa4 2. Bxa4 Bxa4+ 3. Kc5 Rg5+ 4. Kb4 Rg4+ 5. Kc3 Ne7 6. Qa8+ Kd7 7.
b7 Bc6 8. b8=N+ Kd6 9. Qa3+ Ke6 10. Kb2 Rg2+ 11. Kc1 Rg1+ 12. Kd2 Rg2+ 13. Ke1
Rg1+ 14. Kf2 Rg2+ 15. Kf1 Rg5 16. Qa6 Rf5+ 17. Ke1 Re5+ 18. Kf2 Rf5+ 19. Kg3
Rc5 20. Kh3 Rc3+ 21. Kh2 Kd6 22. Qa7 Nd5 23. Na6 Rc2+ 24. Kg1 Rc4 25. Qb8+ Ke6
26. Kh2 Nf6 27. Nb4 Be4 28. Qb6+ Ke5 29. Qb5+ Kd4 30. Kg1 Ng4 31. Qd7+ Ke3 32.
Qa7+ Kd2 33. Qa2+ Kc3 34. Qa3+ Kd2 35. Qb2+ Ke3 36. Qb3+ Kd4 37. Qd1+ Ke3 38.
Qe1+ Kd4 39. Qd2+ Ke5 40. Kf1 Ke6 41. Qa2 Ne5 42. Ke2 Bf3+ 43. Kd2 Be4 44.
Qa6+ Ke7 45. Qa7+ Kf6 46. Qb6+ Kf5 47. Qh6 Nf3+ 48. Ke2 Ne5 49. Qf8+ Ke6 50.
Na6 Bf3+ 51. Kd2 Rd4+ 52. Kc2 Rc4+ 53. Kb1 Be4+ 54. Ka2 Nd3 55. Qe8+ Kf6 56.
Qd8+ Kf5 57. Nc7 Rc2+ 58. Ka3 Rc3+ 59. Ka4 Rc5 60. Na6 Rc1 61. Qh8 Kg4 62. Ka5
Kf3 63. Qf8+ Ke3 64. Kb6 Rc2 65. Qh8 Rc1 66. Qg8 Ke2 67. Qg3 Kd2 68. Qg5+ Ke2
69. Qb5 Kd2 70. Ka7 Ke3 71. Qg5+ Kf3 72. Qh5+ Ke3 73. Qb5 Rc6 74. Qg5+ Kd4 75.
Qg7+ Ke3 76. Qe7 Kf3 77. Qd8 Ke2 78. Qg5 Kf2 79. Qd2+ Kf3 80. Qa5 Rc1 81. Qb6
Rc6 82. Qd4 Kf4 83. Qd8 Ke3 84. Nb8 Rc1 85. Nd7 Ra1+ 86. Kb6 Rb1+ 87. Kc7 Rc1+
88. Kd6 Rc6+ 89. Ke7 Bf5 90. Nf6 Ne5 91. Ne8 Re6+ 92. Kf8 Nd7+ 93. Kf7 Ne5+
94. Kg7 Rg6+ 95. Kf8 Nd7+ 96. Ke7 Ne5 97. Qd1 Re6+ 98. Kf8 Bd3 99. Qe1+ Kd4
100. Qf2+ Ke4 101. Qh4+ Kd5 102. Qa4 Kc5 103. Qa3+ Kd4 104. Nc7 Rf6+ 105. Ke8
Ke4 106. Kd8 Rf7 107. Kc8 Bc4 108. Qd6 Rh7 109. Qd2 Bd3 110. Qb4+ Kf5 111.
Qf8+ Ke4 112. Qg8 Ke3 113. Kb8 Rf7 114. Qg5+ Ke4 115. Qh4+ Kf5 116. Qh6 Ke4
117. Kc8 Be2 118. Qc1 Bf3 119. Kb7 Rf6 120. Kb8 Nc6+ 121. Kc8 Rf8+ 122. Kb7
Nd4 123. Qg5 Kd3+ 124. Ka7 Rf7 125. Qg6+ Rf5 126. Qd6 Kc4 127. Qa6+ Kc3 128.
Qa3+ Kd2 129. Kb8 Rf6 130. Kc8 Bg4+ 131. Kb7 Bf3+ 132. Kb8 Rc6 133. Qa4 Ke3
134. Ne8 Ke4 135. Qb4 Kd5 136. Qd2 Ke4 137. Qe1+ Kd5 138. Qg3 Ke4 139. Nd6+
Kd3 140. Qh2 Rc3 141. Qf2 Bd5 142. Qg1 Bf3 143. Qf1+ Ke3 144. Nc4+ Kf4 145.
Nb2 Rc2 146. Na4 Nc6+ 147. Kb7 Nd4+ 148. Kb6 Rc6+ 149. Ka5 Ke4 150. Qe1+ Kd3
151. Qg1 Be2 152. Nb6 Nb3+ 153. Ka6 Bf3 154. Qf1+ Ke3 155. Qb1 Nd4 156. Ka7
Re6 157. Kb8 Re8+ 158. Kc7 Re7+ 159. Kd6 Re6+ 160. Kd7 Bc6+ 161. Kd8 Re8+ 162.
Kc7 Re7+ 163. Kd6 Re6+ 164. Kc5 Re5+ 165. Kc4 Bb5+ 166. Kb4 Kd2 167. Qh7 Be2
168. Qd7 Rb5+ 169. Ka3 Kd3 170. Na4 Rb3+ 171. Ka2 Rb4 172. Qh3+ Bf3 173. Qh7+
Kd2 174. Nb2 Bd5+ 175. Kb1 Ne2 176. Qc2+ Ke1 177. Ka1 Be4 178. Qd1+ Kf2 179.
Qd2 Rd4 180. Qa5 Nc1 181. Qe5 Ne2 182. Qc5 Ke1 183. Nc4 Bd5 184. Qa5+ Kf2 185.
Nb6 Bc6 186. Kb2 Bb5 187. Qa7 Ke1 188. Qa8 Bd3 189. Qa5+ Kf2 190. Na4 Be4 191.
Nc5 Bd5 192. Qd8 Rb4+ 193. Ka3 Rd4 194. Qc8 Nf4 195. Qf8 Ke1 196. Qh6 Ne2 197.
Qe3 Kd1 198. Nd3 Bg2 199. Nb4 Be4 200. Ka4 Bf5 201. Qa3 Be4 202. Ka5 Ke1 203.
Na6 Bc2 204. Nc5 Rf4 205. Kb6 Bf5 206. Na6 Bg6 207. Qb3 Rf6+ 208. Kb7 Rf4 209.
Nc7 Bf7 210. Qb1+ Kd2 211. Na6 Bd5+ 212. Kb8 Rd4 213. Nc5 Ke3 214. Qa1 Kf2
215. Qa3 Ke1 216. Kc8 Bc4 217. Qb4+ Kd1 218. Qb2 Bd5 219. Qa1+ Kd2 220. Kd8
Be4+ 221. Ke7 Bc2 222. Nd7 Re4+ 223. Ne5 Ke3 224. Kf6 Ra4 225. Qb2 Rf4+ 226.
Kg5 Bd3 227. Qa1 Bf5 228. Qa7+ Kd2 229. Qa5+ Kd1 230. Kf6 Be4+ 231. Ke6 Bc2
232. Ke7 Re4 233. Qa1+ Kd2 234. Kd6 Ra4 235. Qb2 Rf4 236. Kd7 Nc3 237. Qa3
Rd4+ 238. Ke8 Re4 239. Qa5 Bb3 240. Qd8+ Bd5 241. Qg5+ Kc2 242. Kf8 Rd4 243.
Kg7 Be4 244. Qf6 Rb4 245. Kh6 Rb7 246. Ng4 Rd7 247. Ne3+ Kd3 248. Qf1+ Kd4
249. Ng4 Rd5 250. Qg1+ Kd3 251. Qf2 Rf5 252. Qe3+ Kc4 253. Qd2 Kb3 254. Qd7
Ra5 255. Ne3 Ra6+ 256. Kh5 Ra4 257. Qd6 Bf3+ 258. Kh6 Be4 259. Qf6 Bd3 260.
Qd8 Be4 261. Qg8+ Kb2 262. Qb8+ Ka3 263. Qb6 Rb4 264. Qf6 Kb3 265. Qf7+ Ka3
266. Nc4+ Ka4 267. Qe6 Kb3 268. Nb6+ Kc2 269. Qd6 Rb1 270. Nc4 Rh1+ 271. Kg7
Rh7+ 272. Kg8 Rh3 273. Qd2+ Kb3 274. Ne3 Rg3+ 275. Kf8 Rg6 276. Qd4 Rc6 277.
Ke7 Bf3 278. Nf5 Be4 279. Nd6 Bd5 280. Nb5 Bg2 281. Qd3 Kb4 282. Nd4 Rc7+ 283.
Kf6 Rc5 284. Nc2+ Kb3 285. Ne3 Bd5 286. Ke7 Rc7+ 287. Kd8 Rc5 288. Qf5 Kb4
289. Nc2+ Kb5 290. Qe5 Kb6 291. Ne3 Bb7 292. Qd6+ Kb5 293. Qd4 Be4 294. Ke7
Rc6 295. Kf8 Rc8+ 296. Kg7 Rc7+ 297. Kh6 Rc6+ 298. Kh5 Bf3+ 299. Kh4 Rh6+ 300.
Kg5 Rh5+ 301. Kg6 Rc5 302. Qd7+ Kb6 303. Qd8+ Kb5 304. Kg7 Be4 305. Qd7+ Ka5
306. Qd4 Rc7+ 307. Kh6 Rc6+ 308. Kg5 Kb5 309. Ng4 Bd5 310. Ne5 Rc5 311. Qd3+
Ka5 312. Kh6 Rc7 313. Qc2 Nb5 314. Qf2 Nc3 315. Qf8 Kb5 316. Qd6 Rc5 317. Kg7
Be4 318. Qd7+ Bc6 319. Qd3+ Ka5 320. Qd4 Kb5 321. Nf7 Ne4 322. Qb2+ Ka5 323.
Ne5 Nc3 324. Nd3 Rc4 325. Qa3+ Na4 326. Qd6 Kb5 327. Qe5+ Kb6 328. Qe6 Kb5
329. Qf5+ Kb6 330. Qf7 Kb5 331. Ne5 Rc3 332. Qf1+ Kb4 333. Nd3+ Kb5 334. Nf4+
Rc4 335. Ng6 Kb4 336. Qe1+ Kb3 337. Ne5 Rc3 338. Qe2 Kb4 339. Nd3+ Ka5 340.
Nf4 Bb5 341. Qe1 Bc4 342. Ng6 Bb3 343. Ne7 Kb5 344. Qe5+ Rc5 345. Qd4 Rc4 346.
Qd7+ Kb4 347. Qd6+ Kc3 348. Nc6 Kb2 349. Qe5+ Ka2 350. Nd4 Nc5 351. Nb5 Ne6+
352. Kg6 Bc2+ 353. Kf7 Bb3 354. Ke7 Nc5 355. Qe2+ Rc2 356. Qe1 Rc4 357. Qd2+
Rc2 358. Qa5+ Kb2 359. Kf6 Rf2+ 360. Ke5 Re2+ 361. Kf4 Rc2 362. Qa3+ Kb1 363.
Kg4 Rc1 364. Kh5 Rc4 365. Kh6 Rh4+ 366. Kg5 Rc4 367. Kh5 Rc2 368. Qa8 Kb2 369.
Qf3 Rc4 370. Qe2+ Kc1 371. Qe5 Ne4 372. Kg6 Bc2 373. Kf7 Ra4 374. Qd5 Kb2 375.
Nd4 Kc3 376. Ne2+ Kb2 377. Qe5+ Ka2 378. Kg7 Ra7+ 379. Kh6 Ra6+ 380. Kh5 Ra4
381. Qe6+ Ka3 382. Qe7+ Kb2 383. Qg7+ Kb3 384. Qb7+ Rb4 385. Nc1+ Ka3 386. Qe7
Ka4 387. Qa7+ Kb5 388. Qb7+ Kc4 389. Qf7+ Kb5 390. Ne2 Rc4 391. Qb7+ Kc5 392.
Nf4 Nc3 393. Ne6+ Kd6 394. Nd8 Kc5 395. Kh6 Be4 396. Ne6+ Kd6 397. Qb8+ Kc6
398. Qa7 Kd6 399. Nd4 Ke5 400. Qg7+ Kd6 401. Nb3 Bd5 402. Qg3+ Ke6 403. Qg6+
Kd7 404. Nd4 Kc7 405. Qa6 Kb8 406. Qd6+ Ka8 407. Qd7 Rc5 408. Kg6 Bb7 409. Nb3
Rc6+ 410. Kg5 Ne4+ 411. Kf4 Rf6+ 412. Ke3 Rf3+ 413. Kd4 Rf6 414. Qd8+ Ka7 415.
Ke3 Re6 416. Qa5+ Kb8 417. Nd4 Re8 418. Kd3 Ba6+ 419. Kc2 Rc8+ 420. Kb2 Ka7
421. Nb3 Nd6 422. Qa4 Nc4+ 423. Ka1 Rc7 424. Nd4 Nd6 425. Qa3 Nc4 426. Qf8 Nb6
427. Nb3 Nc4 428. Qd8 Rc6 429. Nd4 Rc5 430. Qe7+ Kb6 431. Qe6+ Kb7 432. Qf7+
Kb6 433. Qg6+ Kb7 434. Ne6 Rc8 435. Qg7+ Kb8 436. Nd4 Rc7 437. Qf6 Ka8 438.
Qf4 Rc8 439. Qf7 Kb8 440. Qf6 Bb7 441. Qg5 Bc6 442. Qe7 Bb7 443. Ka2 Bd5 444.
Kb1 Be4+ 445. Kc1 Bc6 446. Qb4+ Ka7 447. Kc2 Nb6 448. Kd3 Bd7 449. Nb3 Rc6
450. Qf8 Rc8 451. Qa3+ Kb8 452. Qd6+ Ka7 453. Nc5 Bb5+ 454. Ke4 Bc6+ 455. Kf4
Nd5+ 456. Kg3 Rg8+ 457. Kf2 Rc8 458. Kf1 Nc3 459. Kg1 Nd5 460. Kf2 Ka8 461.
Ke1 Nc3 462. Qf6 Nd5 463. Qa1+ Kb8 464. Qa6 Re8+ 465. Kd2 Rc8 466. Kd1 Ne7
467. Ke1 Nd5 468. Kd2 Rc7 469. Ne6 Nb4 470. Qa5 Rd7+ 471. Kc1 Nd5 472. Qc5 Ba8
473. Qc2 Re7 474. Qh2+ Ka7 475. Qf2+ Nb6 476. Nc5 Nd5 477. Kd2 Bc6 478. Nb3+
Re3 479. Qg1 Bb5 480. Nd4 Rd3+ 481. Kc1 Bc4 482. Qg6 Nf4 483. Qg7+ Kb6 484.
Qe5 Nd5 485. Qd6+ Kb7 486. Qc6+ Ka7 487. Nf5 Ba6 488. Qc5+ Kb8 489. Qa5 Bb7
490. Nd6 Bc6 491. Nb5 Rb3 492. Qa7+ Kc8 493. Nd6+ Kd8 494. Kd2 Re3 495. Qb8+
Kd7 496. Nf7 Ke7 497. Ne5 Rc3 498. Nd3 Rc4 499. Qa7+ Kd6 500. Qa5 Bd7 501.
Qa3+ Ke6 502. Qa1 Nc3 503. Qa5 Bb5 504. Qd8 Ne4+ 505. Ke3 Nf6 506. Qb6+ Bc6
507. Qa6 Re4+ 508. Kd2 Kd6 509. Qa3+ Kc7 510. Qa5+ Kc8 511. Ne5 Rd4+ 512. Kc1
Rd6 513. Nf7 Rd7 514. Qf5 Ne8 515. Ne5 Nd6 516. Qh3 Bb5 517. Nxd7 Bxd7 518.
Qa3 Kc7 519. Qc5+ Bc6 520. Kc2 Ne4 521. Qe5+ Nd6 522. Kc3 Bb7 523. Kd4 Kc6
524. Qc5+ Kd7 525. Qc2 Ke7 526. Qh2 Ke6 527. Qe5+ Kd7 528. Kc5 Ne4+ 529. Kb6
Nd6 530. Qd4 Ke6 531. Qg4+ Ke5 532. Qh5+ Ke6 533. Kc7 Nf5 534. Kxb7 Ne7 535.
Qg5 Nf5 536. Kb6 Ne7 537. Qh4 Ng6 538. Qg4+ Kf6 539. Kc5 Ne5 540. Qf4+ Ke6
541. Qe4 Kf6 542. Kd5 Ng6 543. Qf3+ Kg5 544. Ke4 Nh8 545. Qc3 Ng6 546. Qg7 Kh5
547. Kf5 Nh4+ 548. Kf6 Ng6 549. Qxg6+ Kh4 550. Qg2 Kh5 551. Qg5#

kindly regards from Germany

PS   who can now compose a longer mate ?

A spoiler alert would have been nice.

Egads translation: I can't believe someone posted a chess puzzle VIA A YOUTUBE LINK. I mean, you know they have an actual link to help you post a chess diagram, or game, BUILT IN to the EDITOR. You know, because this is a CHESS website. But instead I decided to tinyurl those 43 words into a single word, "Egads".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnLiwJ3qe_M

... first eight moves of the solution ...

What about 424.Qa3?

to FM zibbit :

... with 424.Qa3? follows 424. ...Nxa3! and we have a win for black ...

... the correct move is 424.Nd4! and a win for white ...

"Obstrusive" is not a word. The OP probably meant "obtrusive".

Only the first two moves are needed to solve this one, since there will then be only seven men on the board.

The first dual occurs at move 17, when Ke1, Ke2, and Kg1 all lead to mate in another 535 moves.

That is also not a solution. Not all positions with seven men are White wins.

Presumably you refer to the 7 man EGTBs, but simply saying, "It's a win because the EGTB says so", is in no way a solution. A solution should be a proof and that is obviously not.

I didn't say the first two moves are the solution. They provide the information needed to make it easy to find the solution.

Yes of course. But I don't know about "easy". I think it's probably only easy if you accept a Lomonosov pronouncement as the remainder of the solution. (But I have to admit to having not actually attempted it.)

My problem is that, "it's a win in 549", is not actually a solution. The solution is the reason why it's a win in 549. If there's a method in the construction of a problem other than, "Choose a position from the database with a high mating distance", then a reasonably succinct explanation can be given for the "why". Otherwise the explanation could be much bigger than the database itself.

It will be interesting to see the remainder of Moremover's solution, should he post it. If the position is simply random, posting could well be impossible owing to storage constraints at chess.com (not to mention totally impracticable to produce in the first place). 

When the 7-man position is reached, the tablebase can give a line of play ending with White mating on move 549, in which every move by both sides is guaranteed to be optimal. People can decide for themselves whether to call that a solution.

If someone challenges the optimality of a particular move by Black, the tablebase can verify that any other move leads to a mate in the same or fewer moves. Obviously that can't be done in advance for every move by Black.

I'm not denying your contribution and everything you say is perfectly correct.

I wouldn't call a single optimal line of play a solution. As you say people can call it so, in which case they and I would be using the same word for different concepts.

To my mind you only solve a puzzle if you can play it against any opposing play. If you're given a mate in 2, it's not enough to just get the first move and a mate in response to some black reply, you have to be able to see mates for all black replies. In this case any Black reply will be optimal if the puzzle is correct. If you're given a mate in 3 Black's first reply may be suboptimal but you still need to then see a mate in at most 2.

In the case of longer mates the number of lines that constitute what I would call a solution  (optimal White moves, any Black moves) would grow too large to enumerate and a method of play that can be proved to work against all defences has to be given instead. This could for most human composed puzzles be written down in at most a few pages, because it would correspond with the reasoning the composer used in constructing the puzzle. But for positions picked from an EGTB there my be no such succinct method and even if there is, the EGTB cannot tell you what it is, it can only enumerate individual lines.

So if a puzzle solution (with my meaning of the word) cannot be presented in less that say 5 times 10 to the power 273 pages, one has to suspect computer aid in it's construction.